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neurological symptoms are getting worse

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it'd be nice if one of you angel

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slash morons had a clue why we did a

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full history she never mentioned

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seeing or hearing anything unusual

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that's a clip from that show house that

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used to be on a few years ago

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medical show about this arrogant

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over-the-top arrogant

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doctor who has the answer for everything

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and in this case he's debunking a woman

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who sees the spirit of her mother across

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the room

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and i thought wow what a great example

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of what a bubble

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i live in i mean in my bubble after

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death communication

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is well documented and widely reported i

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mean it's widely reported in hospice we

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know that

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from people who've gone in and worked a

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hospice and talked to nurses and doctors

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well reported but it's also in the

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medical literature right like you've

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heard so many times on this show

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after death communication not at all

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uncommon i think if i remember the stats

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60

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among couples that have been together

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for a long long time than have lost one

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or the other

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but also just all the other stuff

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terminal lucidity of course near-death

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experience reincarnation research

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over and over and over again oh and the

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medium research of course

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dr julie bryce held the windbridge

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institute and all the other stuff that

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we talk about in this show

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in my bubble that is all medical fact

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because

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well it is medical fact but i think it's

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good to remember that that

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isn't mainstream and even though there's

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been

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progress most people still identify

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with the house guy here and while this

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seems to be

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incredibly a stuck on stupid kind of

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position

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i also like to take note of the fact

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that it's blocking us from

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a deeper discussion from what i was

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called the level three discussion

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so i have an interview coming up in a

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minute with mark ireland

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who 10 12 years ago wrote the book soul

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shift

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which was really an important book about

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his

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personal journey into exploring after

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death communication

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and i thought this discussion was really

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cool because we got to some places that

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i think really need to be talked about

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and some of them are controversial even

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within our community

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and i just think it's interesting to

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note how these conversations

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can never happen until we get past the

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ridiculousness

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of dr house here's a clip from my

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interview with mark

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i did an interview a few months back

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with the dr mark pittstick

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who is a colleague of gary schwartz at

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university arizona and they're working

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on this project called the soul phone

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i gave mark pretty hard time on the

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other hand

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i don't discount the possibility that

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technology is going to play a role in

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whatever this connection we have is with

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the extended consciousness realm

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and if we understand or think anywhere

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deeply about near-death experience

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we see right off the bat that there's

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certainly a direct connection

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between near-death experience and

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resuscitation

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which is a medical technology i don't

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think god needs our help

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i think things come together to help

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people

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and maybe a medium will help somebody a

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point they need it or whatever

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so that's just one of the topics we

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cover in this interview we kind of go a

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lot of different places

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and then one other place that we go that

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i want to let you know because i posted

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this in the forum

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but i'm not sure everybody saw it mark's

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main mission is to try and help people

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who are experiencing grief

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by connecting them with readings from

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qualified mediums

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and if you remember from a long time

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back when we interviewed dr julie bishol

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this again back to the science a reading

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from a medium

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has been shown to be more efficacious in

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relieving grief

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than any other treatment we know of more

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effective than the pharmaceuticals they

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might throw your way

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more effective than therapy it's just

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those are the numbers if you go do the

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research and do it properly

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those are the numbers you come back with

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and it doesn't mean that we understand

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what a medium reading is or that if it's

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talking with the dead or any of that

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stuff it's just

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hey you can do that experiment and

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that's how it comes out so

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i don't want to digress too far but one

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of the things you need

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once you accept that reality is you need

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good

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mediums and mark is trying to help make

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that happen and you can actually help

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and you can get a free reading

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in the process so stick around and

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listen to this clip

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and then stick around for the rest of

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the interview and if you're interested

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you know you can contact me or contact

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mark

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and we'll try and help make that happen

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here he is explaining it

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and we do need more sitters too so if

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anyone wants to volunteer as a test

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sitter

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i'm totally open to that but there are

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responsibilities that come with it and

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some people are all excited to get the

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free reading but they don't want to do

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the back end work

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so if they're interested in this they

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can go to my website

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hit my contact link and write me okay my

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interview with mark ireland

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is coming up welcome to skeptico where

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we explore controversial science and

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spirituality

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with leading researchers thinkers and

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their critics

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today we welcome back mark ireland to

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skeptico

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now mark as i was just chatting with him

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a little bit about

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is somebody i've known for like a long

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time it was probably

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10 years ago or so that we did an

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interview about his really really

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remarkable book called soul shift

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it's a book about the tragic story

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and the experience that him and his wife

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went through

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of losing their youngest son brandon

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to a rather unusual accident that we'll

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talk about

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and what the book is really about is

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the launching pad that that was for this

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spiritual

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journey that mark has been on and has

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shared with

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so many people and since that time and

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we'll so we'll get into all this in the

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interview but just to set it up a little

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bit

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you know since that time mark has

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pursued not only his own personal

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journey but he's

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had this amazing ability to connect with

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other people

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he started founded helping parents heal

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a global organization for bereaved

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parents i think you told me has

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something like 20 000 global worldwide

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members

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and 100 affiliate organizations have

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joined in and

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you know part of his mission and i think

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part of his purpose

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is explained in why there was even a

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need for that and how it came about

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so that's something we'll talk about as

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well this

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has led to mark's couple of subsequent

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books that mark has written

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messages from the afterlife we'll talk a

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little bit about that

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and a book that i almost i'm tempted to

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say he co-wrote with his father but

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it's not exactly but something like that

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your psychic potential

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the a book that his father richard

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ireland who's

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an amazing amazing person and then

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also plays into this story in so many

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ways so

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mark as i was explaining i was going

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through all this stuff i got why haven't

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i

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years ago

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almost to the month 12 years and one

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month ago so

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it's really incredible and it's

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incredible all that has gone on

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since then and how much things have

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changed but

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i think we have to start with the story

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behind your first book

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soul shift sure um so looking back

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at the time i was in the business field

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and

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my career in advancing

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which is kind of common of a lot of

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people in america

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and had a family a wife and two boys and

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you know probably didn't spend as much

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time or focusing on the family as i

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should have

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would have and

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there was one january day in 2004

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i just started a new job and returned

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home from a trip to california we lived

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in scottsdale arizona

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and um so the night that i got home i

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walked in the front door

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and went back to just the first thing i

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did for whatever reason was walked in my

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son brandon's room and

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opened the door and he was laying there

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watching tv i gave him a hug and we

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didn't even say anything but i was happy

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to see him

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and on a friday night that was kind of

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unusual because he usually would have

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been out with buddies or whatever

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the next morning we got up and i had

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been told that he had planned to go

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on a hike in the mcdowell mountains to

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the top of the mcdowell mountains which

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are in north scottsdale

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and uh right after that i got a little

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bit concerned and he climbed in these

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mountains often

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but for some reason i felt kind of an

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overwhelming concern about it

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almost like i was had a premonition kind

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of thing or whatever

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and later as he prepared to leave i

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asked him not to go

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and he says we're going dad just like

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quit worrying about it you know

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so my wife and i went across town uh

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revisited my

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nephew who was visiting and um

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later that afternoon i get a phone call

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and think oh good it's brandon he's back

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it was actually a call for my older son

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steven

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and he had been working that day got a

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call from boys that brandon was with on

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the mountain

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and brandon apparently had some health

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problems he was

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passing out they said and things weren't

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going well

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but their reception was really poor with

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the cell phone on the mountain so they

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asked if we could call

286
00:09:46,310 --> 00:09:43,920
so steven relayed that to me he was

287
00:09:48,470 --> 00:09:46,320
nervous and he was working so i uh

288
00:09:49,990 --> 00:09:48,480
contacted the authorities and then they

289
00:09:52,870 --> 00:09:50,000
sent a helicopter we had about

290
00:09:54,230 --> 00:09:52,880
a 40-minute drive to get back home by

291
00:09:55,670 --> 00:09:54,240
the time we got to the base of the

292
00:09:58,550 --> 00:09:55,680
mountain there was

293
00:09:59,990 --> 00:09:58,560
a fire truck ambulance helicopter about

294
00:10:03,190 --> 00:10:00,000
100 people i'd say

295
00:10:05,030 --> 00:10:03,200
it was pretty ominous and then i went up

296
00:10:06,550 --> 00:10:05,040
to the first police officer i could find

297
00:10:08,710 --> 00:10:06,560
told him who i was and he

298
00:10:09,670 --> 00:10:08,720
immediately introduced me to a chaplain

299
00:10:11,030 --> 00:10:09,680
which was

300
00:10:13,350 --> 00:10:11,040
concerning because i figured that wasn't

301
00:10:15,110 --> 00:10:13,360
going to be good news and a short time

302
00:10:17,509 --> 00:10:15,120
after that

303
00:10:19,350 --> 00:10:17,519
we had learned that brandon had passed a

304
00:10:21,110 --> 00:10:19,360
pass while he was climbing and we didn't

305
00:10:23,430 --> 00:10:21,120
really know the reason

306
00:10:24,389 --> 00:10:23,440
i talked to his best buddy stu barney

307
00:10:26,790 --> 00:10:24,399
afterward and

308
00:10:28,389 --> 00:10:26,800
steward told me that brian was not

309
00:10:32,470 --> 00:10:28,399
feeling great

310
00:10:33,590 --> 00:10:32,480
and he had i guess he felt like he had a

311
00:10:36,150 --> 00:10:33,600
rapid heartbeat

312
00:10:37,030 --> 00:10:36,160
and um he felt his limbs were kind of

313
00:10:40,150 --> 00:10:37,040
numb

314
00:10:42,150 --> 00:10:40,160
and then that he had vomited and then he

315
00:10:43,190 --> 00:10:42,160
he said i have to lay down we laid down

316
00:10:46,630 --> 00:10:43,200
and that was it

317
00:10:49,190 --> 00:10:46,640
and he basically his eyes rolled back

318
00:10:50,310 --> 00:10:49,200
so uh that was the low point for us as

319
00:10:52,870 --> 00:10:50,320
you can imagine

320
00:10:54,470 --> 00:10:52,880
we uh it was very traumatic and uh we

321
00:10:56,790 --> 00:10:54,480
just went back home and people

322
00:10:57,509 --> 00:10:56,800
came over and tried to give us comfort

323
00:11:02,710 --> 00:10:57,519
and

324
00:11:04,790 --> 00:11:02,720
the grieving process is very very

325
00:11:07,110 --> 00:11:04,800
difficult especially with your kid

326
00:11:09,829 --> 00:11:07,120
i can't imagine anything worse i've lost

327
00:11:12,870 --> 00:11:09,839
other people since then it just

328
00:11:15,110 --> 00:11:12,880
i love them all but it's not the same

329
00:11:16,230 --> 00:11:15,120
and that really led me into this journey

330
00:11:17,509 --> 00:11:16,240
you know and um

331
00:11:19,030 --> 00:11:17,519
i don't know if you want me to continue

332
00:11:20,710 --> 00:11:19,040
or if you want to have something else to

333
00:11:21,910 --> 00:11:20,720
kind of set up the next stage of where

334
00:11:23,509 --> 00:11:21,920
it took me

335
00:11:24,870 --> 00:11:23,519
no we definitely want to go to that next

336
00:11:27,110 --> 00:11:24,880
stage you know the one thing that i'd

337
00:11:29,190 --> 00:11:27,120
add it's a minor point but

338
00:11:30,870 --> 00:11:29,200
you know the mcdowell mountains in

339
00:11:32,630 --> 00:11:30,880
scottsdale are just right there

340
00:11:33,590 --> 00:11:32,640
everybody looks at him it's not like he

341
00:11:36,630 --> 00:11:33,600
was

342
00:11:39,509 --> 00:11:36,640
extreme mountain climbing and everest

343
00:11:41,430 --> 00:11:39,519
i think you know i had one what i see is

344
00:11:44,710 --> 00:11:41,440
an advantage over a lot of folks

345
00:11:45,910 --> 00:11:44,720
who may then lean on a religious faith

346
00:11:51,350 --> 00:11:45,920
or

347
00:11:53,190 --> 00:11:51,360
i had a father who had tremendous

348
00:11:55,269 --> 00:11:53,200
abilities both as a psychic and a

349
00:11:56,470 --> 00:11:55,279
medium as well and a lot of people may

350
00:11:59,509 --> 00:11:56,480
shake their head at that but

351
00:12:02,790 --> 00:11:59,519
i grew up with it i know it's real and i

352
00:12:05,910 --> 00:12:02,800
uh saw examples that were undeniable

353
00:12:08,949 --> 00:12:05,920
and i had that as an evidence-based

354
00:12:11,110 --> 00:12:08,959
knowledge set in my mind in my heart

355
00:12:13,590 --> 00:12:11,120
that helped me immediately know that my

356
00:12:15,190 --> 00:12:13,600
son still existed in some form

357
00:12:16,790 --> 00:12:15,200
although at the time it didn't totally

358
00:12:18,710 --> 00:12:16,800
take away the pain it helped

359
00:12:20,710 --> 00:12:18,720
give me some measure of hope since

360
00:12:22,629 --> 00:12:20,720
you're going to talk about your dad

361
00:12:24,629 --> 00:12:22,639
and we talked about it all those years

362
00:12:26,470 --> 00:12:24,639
ago in your first interview

363
00:12:28,389 --> 00:12:26,480
i think it's a really important part of

364
00:12:30,870 --> 00:12:28,399
the story and i think it can

365
00:12:31,910 --> 00:12:30,880
be spun in a couple of different ways

366
00:12:34,470 --> 00:12:31,920
because

367
00:12:34,949 --> 00:12:34,480
i want you to tell folks who your dad

368
00:12:40,870 --> 00:12:34,959
was

369
00:12:41,990 --> 00:12:40,880
one of the most gifted psychics and he's

370
00:12:43,590 --> 00:12:42,000
on the

371
00:12:45,910 --> 00:12:43,600
what amounts to the tonight show of

372
00:12:47,350 --> 00:12:45,920
today and jimmy kimmel or anything else

373
00:12:49,110 --> 00:12:47,360
you know you can think of

374
00:12:51,430 --> 00:12:49,120
and he's doing these incredible things

375
00:12:53,590 --> 00:12:51,440
he's blindfolded five times over and

376
00:12:55,590 --> 00:12:53,600
he's reading the serial numbers off of

377
00:12:58,790 --> 00:12:55,600
bills that people are randomly

378
00:13:00,470 --> 00:12:58,800
pulling out of his wallet but at the

379
00:13:02,069 --> 00:13:00,480
same time and this is always part of the

380
00:13:04,949 --> 00:13:02,079
story that i remember from you

381
00:13:06,550 --> 00:13:04,959
he's not a perfect dad he's not a

382
00:13:09,509 --> 00:13:06,560
perfect husband

383
00:13:10,629 --> 00:13:09,519
he's not a perfect guy either and your

384
00:13:13,750 --> 00:13:10,639
relationship with him

385
00:13:15,910 --> 00:13:13,760
is not perfect so you know

386
00:13:19,030 --> 00:13:15,920
at this point i think that's what i read

387
00:13:21,110 --> 00:13:19,040
if i'm i hope i got that right but

388
00:13:22,150 --> 00:13:21,120
you know it's complicated life in

389
00:13:25,110 --> 00:13:22,160
general

390
00:13:27,030 --> 00:13:25,120
it's that's life you know also in the

391
00:13:29,350 --> 00:13:27,040
editing process i will say that

392
00:13:30,389 --> 00:13:29,360
the publisher tried to create a little

393
00:13:32,310 --> 00:13:30,399
more tension there

394
00:13:34,629 --> 00:13:32,320
between my dad and i then was really

395
00:13:35,829 --> 00:13:34,639
there and i think that he just felt like

396
00:13:37,430 --> 00:13:35,839
that would make for a better read

397
00:13:38,949 --> 00:13:37,440
although everything in the book is true

398
00:13:41,269 --> 00:13:38,959
he just wanted to create that attention

399
00:13:43,829 --> 00:13:41,279
at a higher level than i saw because i

400
00:13:45,189 --> 00:13:43,839
the truth is i always loved my dad and i

401
00:13:47,829 --> 00:13:45,199
never felt we had a

402
00:13:49,350 --> 00:13:47,839
broken relationship in any way i would

403
00:13:50,949 --> 00:13:49,360
say that you know he wasn't around as

404
00:13:52,550 --> 00:13:50,959
much as i would like did my parents

405
00:13:53,750 --> 00:13:52,560
split when i was young and made it hard

406
00:13:55,829 --> 00:13:53,760
on me

407
00:13:57,030 --> 00:13:55,839
but let me go back to you know his kind

408
00:13:59,269 --> 00:13:57,040
of where he came from

409
00:14:00,150 --> 00:13:59,279
he and i actually interviewed my

410
00:14:03,509 --> 00:14:00,160
grandmother

411
00:14:04,790 --> 00:14:03,519
his mom in 1997 to get more facts about

412
00:14:06,470 --> 00:14:04,800
him growing up so

413
00:14:08,470 --> 00:14:06,480
she actually recognized this in him at

414
00:14:09,910 --> 00:14:08,480
age as early as age three

415
00:14:11,750 --> 00:14:09,920
things that he would be able to know or

416
00:14:13,430 --> 00:14:11,760
whatever and then

417
00:14:15,910 --> 00:14:13,440
age five is when the breakthrough event

418
00:14:16,949 --> 00:14:15,920
happened he was he was born cross-eyed

419
00:14:18,870 --> 00:14:16,959
and his father

420
00:14:20,949 --> 00:14:18,880
his natural father actually teased him a

421
00:14:22,790 --> 00:14:20,959
lot about that and didn't like that

422
00:14:24,870 --> 00:14:22,800
and his brothers did too i mean paint

423
00:14:26,069 --> 00:14:24,880
the whole story they're growing up in

424
00:14:32,790 --> 00:14:26,079
ohio

425
00:14:33,509 --> 00:14:32,800
you know he's the weird kid from the

426
00:14:35,430 --> 00:14:33,519
beginning

427
00:14:37,110 --> 00:14:35,440
and everyone's like why are you such a

428
00:14:39,509 --> 00:14:37,120
weird kid i mean what an

429
00:14:41,509 --> 00:14:39,519
upbringing and then to go on and realize

430
00:14:43,990 --> 00:14:41,519
that this is the guy who will become

431
00:14:45,269 --> 00:14:44,000
one of the most gifted psychics really

432
00:14:47,030 --> 00:14:45,279
that we can point to

433
00:14:48,949 --> 00:14:47,040
evidentially and saying we don't know

434
00:14:49,430 --> 00:14:48,959
what that means but he could do this

435
00:14:51,430 --> 00:14:49,440
stuff

436
00:14:52,870 --> 00:14:51,440
yeah the brothers called him crazy dick

437
00:14:53,350 --> 00:14:52,880
because he would make predictions and

438
00:14:55,110 --> 00:14:53,360
things

439
00:14:56,790 --> 00:14:55,120
you know or like they didn't even have a

440
00:14:58,550 --> 00:14:56,800
telephone and they went we're in rural

441
00:14:59,509 --> 00:14:58,560
ohio so you'd say hey grandpa's coming

442
00:15:00,870 --> 00:14:59,519
over

443
00:15:02,710 --> 00:15:00,880
and then sure enough grandpa would be

444
00:15:04,230 --> 00:15:02,720
there in 10 minutes or whatever

445
00:15:05,910 --> 00:15:04,240
and one time he says yeah grandpa's

446
00:15:07,910 --> 00:15:05,920
coming over but his beard will be gone

447
00:15:09,509 --> 00:15:07,920
and they're like you're crazy crazy dick

448
00:15:10,470 --> 00:15:09,519
you know he loves that beer he never

449
00:15:12,790 --> 00:15:10,480
shaved off

450
00:15:14,790 --> 00:15:12,800
grandpa shows up no beard turns out he

451
00:15:17,189 --> 00:15:14,800
was making taffy the beard got stuck in

452
00:15:19,269 --> 00:15:17,199
the tap and he had to shave it off

453
00:15:21,430 --> 00:15:19,279
but at the age of five he went into the

454
00:15:23,990 --> 00:15:21,440
columbus ohio children's hospital for

455
00:15:25,670 --> 00:15:24,000
corrective surgery on his eyes

456
00:15:27,509 --> 00:15:25,680
and when they were finished um they had

457
00:15:29,110 --> 00:15:27,519
his eyes cupped and bandaged

458
00:15:30,230 --> 00:15:29,120
and they actually tied him to a bed

459
00:15:30,710 --> 00:15:30,240
because they didn't want him messing

460
00:15:33,189 --> 00:15:30,720
with that

461
00:15:34,790 --> 00:15:33,199
and this one nurse felt bad for him and

462
00:15:36,470 --> 00:15:34,800
said i'll let you up you have to promise

463
00:15:38,470 --> 00:15:36,480
not to touch your eyes

464
00:15:40,949 --> 00:15:38,480
and he said that he wouldn't so she let

465
00:15:42,629 --> 00:15:40,959
him up she went on her rounds came back

466
00:15:44,230 --> 00:15:42,639
to find him bouncing a ball against the

467
00:15:46,310 --> 00:15:44,240
wrong catching it thinking oh my god

468
00:15:47,670 --> 00:15:46,320
he's taking the bandages off

469
00:15:49,829 --> 00:15:47,680
but he actually hadn't which was

470
00:15:51,749 --> 00:15:49,839
probably even scarier to her

471
00:15:53,430 --> 00:15:51,759
and then she called in some doctors to

472
00:15:55,990 --> 00:15:53,440
say hey look at this kid and

473
00:15:57,670 --> 00:15:56,000
they tried some different tests on him

474
00:15:59,110 --> 00:15:57,680
he'd be in his bed and they'd have like

475
00:16:00,790 --> 00:15:59,120
one standing at the foot of the bed and

476
00:16:03,590 --> 00:16:00,800
another in the doorway

477
00:16:05,110 --> 00:16:03,600
saying okay who's in front of you now he

478
00:16:05,670 --> 00:16:05,120
would always get it right so that was

479
00:16:08,069 --> 00:16:05,680
kind of

480
00:16:09,189 --> 00:16:08,079
breaking out to where they knew you know

481
00:16:12,310 --> 00:16:09,199
he really had this

482
00:16:13,670 --> 00:16:12,320
ability but it wasn't until like age 12

483
00:16:15,590 --> 00:16:13,680
or 13 that it came

484
00:16:17,350 --> 00:16:15,600
that he kind of revisited it in a

485
00:16:19,030 --> 00:16:17,360
stronger way i think it was always there

486
00:16:21,110 --> 00:16:19,040
and he'd say those things like grandpa's

487
00:16:23,350 --> 00:16:21,120
coming or whatever

488
00:16:25,189 --> 00:16:23,360
but he actually stumbled into it now by

489
00:16:26,870 --> 00:16:25,199
then his parents had divorced

490
00:16:28,870 --> 00:16:26,880
and he was with his mother living in a

491
00:16:29,829 --> 00:16:28,880
little town called ashley ohio at the

492
00:16:31,670 --> 00:16:29,839
time

493
00:16:33,509 --> 00:16:31,680
and there was a spiritualist camp there

494
00:16:35,269 --> 00:16:33,519
that he stumbled into

495
00:16:37,269 --> 00:16:35,279
and this is kind of his introduction to

496
00:16:39,350 --> 00:16:37,279
this whole thing or thinking hey

497
00:16:41,910 --> 00:16:39,360
this is kind of normal for some people

498
00:16:44,470 --> 00:16:41,920
i'm not the only one

499
00:16:46,389 --> 00:16:44,480
shortly before going to that church he

500
00:16:47,110 --> 00:16:46,399
had lost his best friend in a car

501
00:16:49,189 --> 00:16:47,120
accident

502
00:16:50,710 --> 00:16:49,199
i don't know how whether it was weeks or

503
00:16:53,189 --> 00:16:50,720
months earlier

504
00:16:54,389 --> 00:16:53,199
um and i think the kid's name was melvin

505
00:16:56,790 --> 00:16:54,399
mccarty if i remember

506
00:16:58,870 --> 00:16:56,800
correctly so he stumbles in you know

507
00:17:02,870 --> 00:16:58,880
after this to the spiritualist camp

508
00:17:04,870 --> 00:17:02,880
he goes in and this woman asks you know

509
00:17:07,189 --> 00:17:04,880
what what's your name or you know write

510
00:17:08,549 --> 00:17:07,199
your name on this piece of paper or ask

511
00:17:09,990 --> 00:17:08,559
a question he says i don't know what to

512
00:17:10,870 --> 00:17:10,000
ask she goes we'll just say a message

513
00:17:13,590 --> 00:17:10,880
please

514
00:17:15,189 --> 00:17:13,600
so he wrote that on paper he sat down

515
00:17:17,029 --> 00:17:15,199
and there was a man who at the time did

516
00:17:19,510 --> 00:17:17,039
what my dad would later do

517
00:17:21,189 --> 00:17:19,520
who blindfolded himself and got all

518
00:17:23,669 --> 00:17:21,199
these papers and he got my dads and he

519
00:17:25,510 --> 00:17:23,679
says oh richard ireland he says

520
00:17:26,789 --> 00:17:25,520
i've got a young man here who who's

521
00:17:29,190 --> 00:17:26,799
crossed over

522
00:17:29,990 --> 00:17:29,200
and he gives me a secret name and the

523
00:17:33,110 --> 00:17:30,000
secret name is

524
00:17:35,750 --> 00:17:33,120
paisey well my dad and this kid

525
00:17:37,669 --> 00:17:35,760
had exchanged these code names and the

526
00:17:39,510 --> 00:17:37,679
kid's code name was paisley

527
00:17:41,669 --> 00:17:39,520
so that wasn't on the paper and there's

528
00:17:43,750 --> 00:17:41,679
no way this guy could have known that so

529
00:17:45,270 --> 00:17:43,760
after that the man kind of took him

530
00:17:48,150 --> 00:17:45,280
under his wing and said you know

531
00:17:49,830 --> 00:17:48,160
i see you doing what i do someday and he

532
00:17:52,950 --> 00:17:49,840
kind of mentored him in the process

533
00:17:54,470 --> 00:17:52,960
but he kind of held off for the time

534
00:17:55,909 --> 00:17:54,480
being because my grandmother was

535
00:17:56,789 --> 00:17:55,919
informed like look at this age you don't

536
00:17:59,110 --> 00:17:56,799
want to get him

537
00:18:00,470 --> 00:17:59,120
too engaged in this now he needs to grow

538
00:18:02,710 --> 00:18:00,480
up as a normal kid

539
00:18:03,750 --> 00:18:02,720
and it was about 18 or 19 that he he

540
00:18:07,190 --> 00:18:03,760
really started

541
00:18:07,909 --> 00:18:07,200
developing more and um demonstrating in

542
00:18:09,830 --> 00:18:07,919
public he

543
00:18:12,070 --> 00:18:09,840
he ended up the national spiritualist

544
00:18:14,150 --> 00:18:12,080
association of churches at the time

545
00:18:16,549 --> 00:18:14,160
it still exists was a network of these

546
00:18:19,029 --> 00:18:16,559
spiritualist churches throughout america

547
00:18:20,710 --> 00:18:19,039
and he was ordained by them through the

548
00:18:22,310 --> 00:18:20,720
morris pratt institute

549
00:18:24,390 --> 00:18:22,320
and then he became basically a traveling

550
00:18:26,310 --> 00:18:24,400
minister and demonstrate in the

551
00:18:27,270 --> 00:18:26,320
spiritualist tradition demonstrating his

552
00:18:29,510 --> 00:18:27,280
phenomena

553
00:18:31,750 --> 00:18:29,520
is really a core part of their whole

554
00:18:33,750 --> 00:18:31,760
thing they're not heavy on dogma

555
00:18:35,110 --> 00:18:33,760
they're more heavy on experience and

556
00:18:37,430 --> 00:18:35,120
demonstrating

557
00:18:38,630 --> 00:18:37,440
what you know paul called the gifts of

558
00:18:40,549 --> 00:18:38,640
the spirit

559
00:18:42,070 --> 00:18:40,559
so that was my dad's kind of upbringing

560
00:18:45,270 --> 00:18:42,080
and breaking out

561
00:18:48,870 --> 00:18:45,280
and so i would say you know

562
00:18:50,630 --> 00:18:48,880
he met my mom in 1956 at a church dance

563
00:18:52,950 --> 00:18:50,640
in phoenix when he was traveling at the

564
00:18:54,310 --> 00:18:52,960
time he was set up on a blind date and

565
00:18:56,470 --> 00:18:54,320
they hit it off and then they were

566
00:18:58,630 --> 00:18:56,480
married pretty quickly

567
00:19:00,870 --> 00:18:58,640
um so they were assigned to a few

568
00:19:02,390 --> 00:19:00,880
different churches but in like 1960 he

569
00:19:04,950 --> 00:19:02,400
broke out and he says even

570
00:19:06,470 --> 00:19:04,960
you know the spiritualist churches are

571
00:19:07,750 --> 00:19:06,480
still too dogmatic for me

572
00:19:09,669 --> 00:19:07,760
you know i want something where it's

573
00:19:10,230 --> 00:19:09,679
more free and open for i just want to

574
00:19:12,710 --> 00:19:10,240
trigger

575
00:19:14,950 --> 00:19:12,720
people to think for themselves and come

576
00:19:17,350 --> 00:19:14,960
to their own spiritual conclusions

577
00:19:19,190 --> 00:19:17,360
so he he started the university of life

578
00:19:22,549 --> 00:19:19,200
church at that time

579
00:19:24,310 --> 00:19:22,559
and it was later probably in the mid 60s

580
00:19:25,029 --> 00:19:24,320
that he broke out of just the church

581
00:19:27,350 --> 00:19:25,039
thing and started

582
00:19:28,310 --> 00:19:27,360
doing secular venues tv shows and

583
00:19:31,669 --> 00:19:28,320
whatnot

584
00:19:34,230 --> 00:19:31,679
because he really wanted to not just

585
00:19:34,870 --> 00:19:34,240
i guess talk to preacher the choir so to

586
00:19:37,750 --> 00:19:34,880
say but

587
00:19:37,990 --> 00:19:37,760
to open minds of skeptical people or

588
00:19:40,710 --> 00:19:38,000
just

589
00:19:42,230 --> 00:19:40,720
mainstream people who have no necessary

590
00:19:44,630 --> 00:19:42,240
belief set or whatever

591
00:19:45,909 --> 00:19:44,640
and that's when he uh got into doing

592
00:19:47,510 --> 00:19:45,919
things like the steve allen show and

593
00:19:49,029 --> 00:19:47,520
people could see that clip if they go to

594
00:19:51,350 --> 00:19:49,039
my website

595
00:19:52,950 --> 00:19:51,360
um and and other clips as well that's

596
00:19:54,630 --> 00:19:52,960
the best one i have unfortunately at

597
00:19:57,430 --> 00:19:54,640
this point i don't have a whole

598
00:19:58,710 --> 00:19:57,440
treasure trove of these but he you know

599
00:20:01,029 --> 00:19:58,720
essentially his

600
00:20:02,470 --> 00:20:01,039
he could do a variety of things

601
00:20:03,909 --> 00:20:02,480
including mediumship

602
00:20:05,750 --> 00:20:03,919
bringing through first and last name

603
00:20:07,029 --> 00:20:05,760
specifics about people that was very

604
00:20:08,149 --> 00:20:07,039
healing and you would do that more in

605
00:20:09,750 --> 00:20:08,159
the church

606
00:20:11,270 --> 00:20:09,760
in the secular venue it was presented

607
00:20:13,110 --> 00:20:11,280
more as entertainment because that's

608
00:20:15,029 --> 00:20:13,120
what people could digest at that time in

609
00:20:16,470 --> 00:20:15,039
the 60s and 70s

610
00:20:18,710 --> 00:20:16,480
and you had you know the whole duke

611
00:20:19,029 --> 00:20:18,720
university parapsychology thing going on

612
00:20:20,070 --> 00:20:19,039
so

613
00:20:22,149 --> 00:20:20,080
you know he looked at that for

614
00:20:25,350 --> 00:20:22,159
credibility and

615
00:20:26,070 --> 00:20:25,360
um you know essentially he would tape

616
00:20:28,230 --> 00:20:26,080
his eyes with

617
00:20:30,149 --> 00:20:28,240
ten strips of johnson johnson medical

618
00:20:31,430 --> 00:20:30,159
tape which was sealed tightly around

619
00:20:33,110 --> 00:20:31,440
here and all of them

620
00:20:34,870 --> 00:20:33,120
and then three black blindfolds and then

621
00:20:37,350 --> 00:20:34,880
more tape down over here

622
00:20:38,950 --> 00:20:37,360
there are people who have you know tried

623
00:20:41,590 --> 00:20:38,960
to do blindfold stuff where they

624
00:20:43,430 --> 00:20:41,600
are trickery they use trickery usually

625
00:20:44,149 --> 00:20:43,440
they would use coins over the eyeballs

626
00:20:45,430 --> 00:20:44,159
is what i've

627
00:20:47,270 --> 00:20:45,440
done some research on this and they

628
00:20:50,230 --> 00:20:47,280
would somehow learn how to push

629
00:20:51,510 --> 00:20:50,240
out the blindfold with the coins and

630
00:20:53,990 --> 00:20:51,520
then they could look down well

631
00:20:55,029 --> 00:20:54,000
my dad didn't use coins he taped under

632
00:20:56,789 --> 00:20:55,039
the eyes

633
00:20:58,470 --> 00:20:56,799
the blindfolds over then more tape down

634
00:21:00,950 --> 00:20:58,480
to here and when you

635
00:21:02,549 --> 00:21:00,960
see you know the information you'd share

636
00:21:04,390 --> 00:21:02,559
it wasn't just what was on the paper

637
00:21:06,710 --> 00:21:04,400
there was a lot more there

638
00:21:09,430 --> 00:21:06,720
uh very specific stuff about people's

639
00:21:11,029 --> 00:21:09,440
lives and direction and things like that

640
00:21:13,350 --> 00:21:11,039
and even though like if you watch it

641
00:21:15,029 --> 00:21:13,360
steve allen he probably talks to i don't

642
00:21:16,630 --> 00:21:15,039
know eight or ten people

643
00:21:17,909 --> 00:21:16,640
in a normal setting he'd have an

644
00:21:20,390 --> 00:21:17,919
audience of a hundred people he'd

645
00:21:21,909 --> 00:21:20,400
probably give a message to 50 people so

646
00:21:23,830 --> 00:21:21,919
there's no way you could have 50 plants

647
00:21:27,270 --> 00:21:23,840
out of a hundred people

648
00:21:28,149 --> 00:21:27,280
and um anyhow that's kind of the core of

649
00:21:30,710 --> 00:21:28,159
what he did

650
00:21:33,029 --> 00:21:30,720
you know what he was about i would say

651
00:21:37,830 --> 00:21:35,350
see you you were worried that i was

652
00:21:41,510 --> 00:21:37,840
going to go all skeptical on you

653
00:21:42,470 --> 00:21:41,520
and uh yeah yeah just just about to do

654
00:21:45,430 --> 00:21:42,480
that

655
00:21:47,110 --> 00:21:45,440
you know in reading about you personally

656
00:21:47,430 --> 00:21:47,120
one of the things i really resonated

657
00:21:50,870 --> 00:21:47,440
with

658
00:21:54,230 --> 00:21:50,880
is you just kind of saying i'm open

659
00:21:56,630 --> 00:21:54,240
i'm i'm open i'm here i'm a vehicle i'm

660
00:21:57,510 --> 00:21:56,640
about compassion i get it i'm about

661
00:22:00,149 --> 00:21:57,520
compassion

662
00:22:02,230 --> 00:22:00,159
i'm about love i'm about spirit you take

663
00:22:05,270 --> 00:22:02,240
me where you need me to go

664
00:22:08,630 --> 00:22:05,280
but i also see you as kind of

665
00:22:08,950 --> 00:22:08,640
resistant to the idea that you need to

666
00:22:11,669 --> 00:22:08,960
go

667
00:22:12,070 --> 00:22:11,679
on the steve allen show the jimmy kimmel

668
00:22:14,950 --> 00:22:12,080
show

669
00:22:15,990 --> 00:22:14,960
it's like if that's where i'm pushed

670
00:22:18,390 --> 00:22:16,000
that's okay

671
00:22:19,270 --> 00:22:18,400
but we sure as hell seem to see a lot of

672
00:22:21,990 --> 00:22:19,280
people

673
00:22:22,870 --> 00:22:22,000
that use the kind of end justifies the

674
00:22:25,990 --> 00:22:22,880
mean you know

675
00:22:28,149 --> 00:22:26,000
uh god needs god needs my help

676
00:22:29,909 --> 00:22:28,159
god needs me to set up a new church god

677
00:22:33,830 --> 00:22:29,919
needs me to recruit these people

678
00:22:37,669 --> 00:22:33,840
god needs me and it just it doesn't

679
00:22:40,149 --> 00:22:37,679
evidentially big picture it doesn't fly

680
00:22:42,710 --> 00:22:40,159
it doesn't work it doesn't fit the whole

681
00:22:45,750 --> 00:22:42,720
the whole scenario so

682
00:22:49,190 --> 00:22:45,760
let's jump right in really deep and

683
00:22:52,470 --> 00:22:49,200
am i right about that you tell me

684
00:22:53,110 --> 00:22:52,480
how you understand your place in all

685
00:22:55,029 --> 00:22:53,120
this

686
00:22:56,630 --> 00:22:55,039
you're obviously a guy like i said who

687
00:22:59,430 --> 00:22:56,640
has feet

688
00:23:00,789 --> 00:22:59,440
planted in both worlds my dad you know i

689
00:23:02,549 --> 00:23:00,799
think his ego did

690
00:23:04,549 --> 00:23:02,559
he didn't go into it with an ego

691
00:23:07,990 --> 00:23:04,559
motivation but i think it did

692
00:23:09,270 --> 00:23:08,000
it obviously expanded i think for a lot

693
00:23:10,710 --> 00:23:09,280
of people that's going to be a natural

694
00:23:12,230 --> 00:23:10,720
outcome we're getting more attention and

695
00:23:14,390 --> 00:23:12,240
fame and that sort of thing

696
00:23:15,590 --> 00:23:14,400
why do you say natural outcome i say the

697
00:23:17,430 --> 00:23:15,600
opposite of that it's an

698
00:23:18,710 --> 00:23:17,440
unnatural outcome i think if you're

699
00:23:20,390 --> 00:23:18,720
aligned with spirit

700
00:23:22,310 --> 00:23:20,400
you're you're constantly saying that

701
00:23:23,110 --> 00:23:22,320
that's a pro that's a pothole i don't

702
00:23:25,590 --> 00:23:23,120
fall into

703
00:23:26,549 --> 00:23:25,600
no that's true and i think he got pulled

704
00:23:29,590 --> 00:23:26,559
back

705
00:23:31,430 --> 00:23:29,600
time and again too for that you know and

706
00:23:33,270 --> 00:23:31,440
i think at the core of it

707
00:23:35,190 --> 00:23:33,280
his heart was in the right place i guess

708
00:23:36,070 --> 00:23:35,200
you have the question is if you have a

709
00:23:37,110 --> 00:23:36,080
gift to share

710
00:23:38,789 --> 00:23:37,120
how do you share it where's the

711
00:23:40,230 --> 00:23:38,799
framework do you go on to you you're not

712
00:23:43,669 --> 00:23:40,240
you hide it under a bushel

713
00:23:46,070 --> 00:23:43,679
you you know do you you expose other

714
00:23:48,230 --> 00:23:46,080
people to things that tell them that

715
00:23:49,909 --> 00:23:48,240
there's more to us than just being a

716
00:23:51,029 --> 00:23:49,919
biological robot in the meaningless

717
00:23:51,669 --> 00:23:51,039
universe like you said and that was

718
00:23:53,669 --> 00:23:51,679
really

719
00:23:55,190 --> 00:23:53,679
what he wanted to do so let's move on to

720
00:23:58,630 --> 00:23:55,200
me and my mission

721
00:24:01,029 --> 00:23:58,640
um so after my son passed looking back

722
00:24:03,269 --> 00:24:01,039
on that framework and knowing that

723
00:24:05,510 --> 00:24:03,279
in my heart there's a spiritual realm

724
00:24:08,390 --> 00:24:05,520
and that some people can connect to it

725
00:24:09,110 --> 00:24:08,400
to um share positive messages or give

726
00:24:10,789 --> 00:24:09,120
some sense of

727
00:24:13,430 --> 00:24:10,799
connection with those that they have

728
00:24:16,070 --> 00:24:13,440
loved that have passed

729
00:24:17,590 --> 00:24:16,080
that helped me um and at that the first

730
00:24:19,990 --> 00:24:17,600
thing i did was

731
00:24:21,830 --> 00:24:20,000
contact my uncle because my father had

732
00:24:23,669 --> 00:24:21,840
passed by that point my uncle had

733
00:24:25,350 --> 00:24:23,679
similar abilities

734
00:24:27,190 --> 00:24:25,360
and i asked him you know if he could

735
00:24:28,549 --> 00:24:27,200
help and he said well what can i do for

736
00:24:30,630 --> 00:24:28,559
you i just said if you if you have any

737
00:24:32,230 --> 00:24:30,640
way to connect then let me know

738
00:24:34,390 --> 00:24:32,240
the brain brand's okay i'd appreciate

739
00:24:35,750 --> 00:24:34,400
that and it was i think three days later

740
00:24:37,190 --> 00:24:35,760
i was in the mortuary making

741
00:24:38,950 --> 00:24:37,200
arrangements

742
00:24:40,230 --> 00:24:38,960
either he called me or i called him i

743
00:24:41,830 --> 00:24:40,240
can't remember but

744
00:24:44,230 --> 00:24:41,840
he said hey mark i've got something to

745
00:24:45,830 --> 00:24:44,240
share with you i tried to meditate last

746
00:24:47,750 --> 00:24:45,840
night i didn't get anything but i woke

747
00:24:49,510 --> 00:24:47,760
up this morning and did my meditation

748
00:24:52,149 --> 00:24:49,520
and your dad came to me

749
00:24:53,990 --> 00:24:52,159
he wanted you to know that brandon that

750
00:24:54,549 --> 00:24:54,000
he was there to help ryan cross over and

751
00:24:56,870 --> 00:24:54,559
adjust

752
00:24:58,070 --> 00:24:56,880
and that you're the best parents he ever

753
00:25:00,149 --> 00:24:58,080
could have had which is

754
00:25:01,269 --> 00:25:00,159
what we like to hear but then he also

755
00:25:02,710 --> 00:25:01,279
shared because we didn't have we didn't

756
00:25:03,830 --> 00:25:02,720
know the cause of death at the time and

757
00:25:05,590 --> 00:25:03,840
he said your dad

758
00:25:07,830 --> 00:25:05,600
tells me that brandon's death was caused

759
00:25:10,070 --> 00:25:07,840
by a lack of oxygen in his bloodstream

760
00:25:11,510 --> 00:25:10,080
that causes heart to fail and a couple

761
00:25:14,230 --> 00:25:11,520
days after that i talked to the

762
00:25:16,950 --> 00:25:14,240
physician who did the autopsy she

763
00:25:17,750 --> 00:25:16,960
uh had noted that brandon had died from

764
00:25:43,669 --> 00:25:17,760
a

765
00:25:46,390 --> 00:25:43,679
they're showing

766
00:25:47,590 --> 00:25:46,400
gary schwartz doing the uh the human

767
00:25:50,149 --> 00:25:47,600
energy systems lab

768
00:25:50,630 --> 00:25:50,159
down at the university of arizona he's

769
00:25:52,149 --> 00:25:50,640
uh

770
00:25:54,390 --> 00:25:52,159
testing different mediums this

771
00:25:55,750 --> 00:25:54,400
particular one it showed allison dubois

772
00:25:57,830 --> 00:25:55,760
as a test medium

773
00:25:59,669 --> 00:25:57,840
with sitters behind that couldn't see

774
00:26:01,350 --> 00:25:59,679
and she's sharing some very specific

775
00:26:02,789 --> 00:26:01,360
information i was pretty impressed i

776
00:26:04,230 --> 00:26:02,799
thought god i'd love to

777
00:26:06,710 --> 00:26:04,240
have a reason with her i'd love to be in

778
00:26:08,549 --> 00:26:06,720
that lab the very next day i get a call

779
00:26:09,350 --> 00:26:08,559
from a man named jerry concert out of

780
00:26:11,990 --> 00:26:09,360
dallas

781
00:26:13,510 --> 00:26:12,000
who was friends with my father and jerry

782
00:26:13,990 --> 00:26:13,520
says hey mark i know you've been through

783
00:26:15,510 --> 00:26:14,000
a lot

784
00:26:17,190 --> 00:26:15,520
um i know someone who might be able to

785
00:26:18,070 --> 00:26:17,200
help you her name's allison dubois

786
00:26:20,950 --> 00:26:18,080
here's a number

787
00:26:21,990 --> 00:26:20,960
you know so i called i made arrangements

788
00:26:25,190 --> 00:26:22,000
i got a reading

789
00:26:26,310 --> 00:26:25,200
with her later that year and then about

790
00:26:29,590 --> 00:26:26,320
a year later i actually

791
00:26:31,590 --> 00:26:29,600
ended up in that lab as a test sitter

792
00:26:32,710 --> 00:26:31,600
for a different medium for a discovery

793
00:26:35,750 --> 00:26:32,720
channel but

794
00:26:36,149 --> 00:26:35,760
so that was pretty cool and i had sought

795
00:26:37,830 --> 00:26:36,159
out

796
00:26:39,990 --> 00:26:37,840
i started meeting other people in the

797
00:26:40,950 --> 00:26:40,000
field in this field of mediumship and

798
00:26:42,870 --> 00:26:40,960
parapsychology

799
00:26:44,149 --> 00:26:42,880
hey mark share a little bit like you did

800
00:26:46,149 --> 00:26:44,159
with me

801
00:26:48,230 --> 00:26:46,159
some of the things that came through in

802
00:26:50,470 --> 00:26:48,240
the reading with allison dubois

803
00:26:52,230 --> 00:26:50,480
yeah and it was actually i'd say that

804
00:26:53,750 --> 00:26:52,240
she gave me a lot of good information

805
00:26:56,470 --> 00:26:53,760
but it was actually linda williamson in

806
00:26:59,269 --> 00:26:56,480
england gave me more of the future stuff

807
00:26:59,990 --> 00:26:59,279
but uh allison had first off she didn't

808
00:27:02,549 --> 00:27:00,000
know me

809
00:27:03,750 --> 00:27:02,559
and she knew really nothing about me

810
00:27:05,269 --> 00:27:03,760
when i came in some

811
00:27:07,510 --> 00:27:05,279
she had been told that my dad was a

812
00:27:10,549 --> 00:27:07,520
psychic that's all she knew

813
00:27:12,710 --> 00:27:10,559
but she was able to identify that i

814
00:27:14,310 --> 00:27:12,720
had a sun pass cause of death you know

815
00:27:16,549 --> 00:27:14,320
she felt like it was a drowning in the

816
00:27:18,789 --> 00:27:16,559
lungs and actually the autopsy

817
00:27:20,070 --> 00:27:18,799
physician had described what had

818
00:27:22,070 --> 00:27:20,080
happened to brandon

819
00:27:23,830 --> 00:27:22,080
a severe asthma attack causes the lungs

820
00:27:25,830 --> 00:27:23,840
to expand to almost touch in the middle

821
00:27:28,630 --> 00:27:25,840
that only happens in cases of

822
00:27:30,870 --> 00:27:28,640
severe asthma or drownings so that was

823
00:27:33,029 --> 00:27:30,880
ironic you know that description

824
00:27:34,870 --> 00:27:33,039
she but i think with her the craziest

825
00:27:35,590 --> 00:27:34,880
thing was two weeks before i met with

826
00:27:38,070 --> 00:27:35,600
her

827
00:27:39,590 --> 00:27:38,080
i was handed a box that contained this

828
00:27:41,750 --> 00:27:39,600
manuscript that you mentioned earlier

829
00:27:43,909 --> 00:27:41,760
called your psychic potential

830
00:27:45,990 --> 00:27:43,919
and um it was a book that had been

831
00:27:46,789 --> 00:27:46,000
written in like 1973 but was never

832
00:27:48,710 --> 00:27:46,799
published

833
00:27:50,310 --> 00:27:48,720
so the guy who gave it to me i said well

834
00:27:51,909 --> 00:27:50,320
how did you get this he goes well before

835
00:27:53,909 --> 00:27:51,919
your dad died he gave it to me you were

836
00:27:55,430 --> 00:27:53,919
out of state at the time

837
00:27:56,789 --> 00:27:55,440
and i said well it's been 12 years since

838
00:27:57,669 --> 00:27:56,799
my dad died why are you giving this to

839
00:27:58,870 --> 00:27:57,679
me now

840
00:28:01,350 --> 00:27:58,880
because i don't know i just feel like

841
00:28:03,350 --> 00:28:01,360
i'm supposed to so here it is two weeks

842
00:28:03,750 --> 00:28:03,360
later now i met with allison dubois she

843
00:28:06,149 --> 00:28:03,760
goes

844
00:28:07,430 --> 00:28:06,159
um your dad's showing me a book i feel

845
00:28:09,510 --> 00:28:07,440
it's his book

846
00:28:11,110 --> 00:28:09,520
and he's he's handing this to you it's

847
00:28:12,070 --> 00:28:11,120
for you to take forward does that make

848
00:28:15,350 --> 00:28:12,080
sense

849
00:28:17,350 --> 00:28:15,360
i thought that was pretty crazy um so

850
00:28:19,190 --> 00:28:17,360
one of the other mediums that i went to

851
00:28:21,830 --> 00:28:19,200
was linda williamson

852
00:28:24,549 --> 00:28:21,840
in england and she's famous or somewhat

853
00:28:26,470 --> 00:28:24,559
famous for having given john edward

854
00:28:27,590 --> 00:28:26,480
um a secret code now john edwards a

855
00:28:29,830 --> 00:28:27,600
pretty well-known

856
00:28:31,909 --> 00:28:29,840
well-known medium on the east coast

857
00:28:34,710 --> 00:28:31,919
john's mom died and they had agreed to a

858
00:28:37,669 --> 00:28:34,720
secret code like the houdini code thing

859
00:28:39,029 --> 00:28:37,679
and um so he had been to two mediums

860
00:28:40,149 --> 00:28:39,039
before her to see if somebody could

861
00:28:42,789 --> 00:28:40,159
bring through the code

862
00:28:44,549 --> 00:28:42,799
so he goes to linda williamson and she

863
00:28:46,389 --> 00:28:44,559
starts off and he thinks i'm more of the

864
00:28:48,149 --> 00:28:46,399
same and then all of a sudden she said

865
00:28:49,830 --> 00:28:48,159
uh your mother's here and she's telling

866
00:28:50,630 --> 00:28:49,840
me that she's the guiding light in your

867
00:28:52,149 --> 00:28:50,640
life

868
00:28:54,149 --> 00:28:52,159
she's like that's it that's a secret

869
00:28:57,110 --> 00:28:54,159
code she was a soap opera fan and

870
00:28:58,470 --> 00:28:57,120
guiding light was her favorite show so

871
00:29:00,470 --> 00:28:58,480
that's her kind of thing

872
00:29:02,389 --> 00:29:00,480
but um when i had this meeting with

873
00:29:04,230 --> 00:29:02,399
linda williamson

874
00:29:06,149 --> 00:29:04,240
um she had brought through a lot of

875
00:29:08,149 --> 00:29:06,159
information about me and my place at the

876
00:29:10,830 --> 00:29:08,159
time now i was a nobody and i was

877
00:29:13,590 --> 00:29:10,840
i didn't have a book or anything at the

878
00:29:14,549 --> 00:29:13,600
time she said you know you're going to

879
00:29:16,549 --> 00:29:14,559
you're going to be leading an

880
00:29:17,750 --> 00:29:16,559
organization it's going to form around

881
00:29:21,190 --> 00:29:17,760
you

882
00:29:21,990 --> 00:29:21,200
or why but they're going to be guiding

883
00:29:23,269 --> 00:29:22,000
you and helping you

884
00:29:25,990 --> 00:29:23,279
arrange this and you'll meet the right

885
00:29:27,909 --> 00:29:26,000
people and people will come and

886
00:29:29,430 --> 00:29:27,919
build around you um all you have to do

887
00:29:30,950 --> 00:29:29,440
is just tell your story and be yourself

888
00:29:33,110 --> 00:29:30,960
that's all you have to do

889
00:29:34,070 --> 00:29:33,120
and this thing will expand and grow i'm

890
00:29:35,510 --> 00:29:34,080
like okay well

891
00:29:37,110 --> 00:29:35,520
i don't know what you're talking about

892
00:29:38,630 --> 00:29:37,120
and uh but like

893
00:29:40,789 --> 00:29:38,640
you brought up earlier helping parents

894
00:29:43,350 --> 00:29:40,799
heal now has about a

895
00:29:46,070 --> 00:29:43,360
close to 100 affiliates worldwide 20 000

896
00:29:47,750 --> 00:29:46,080
members at least facebook members

897
00:29:49,190 --> 00:29:47,760
on what's a private group it's actually

898
00:29:50,710 --> 00:29:49,200
hard to join because we want to make

899
00:29:53,269 --> 00:29:50,720
sure the people who are joining

900
00:29:54,470 --> 00:29:53,279
actually are bereaved parents one of the

901
00:29:55,830 --> 00:29:54,480
things she shared with you that i

902
00:29:57,190 --> 00:29:55,840
thought was interesting and again we can

903
00:29:57,510 --> 00:29:57,200
take in a lot of different directions

904
00:30:01,350 --> 00:29:57,520
but

905
00:30:03,830 --> 00:30:01,360
she says there is this network

906
00:30:05,830 --> 00:30:03,840
on the other side and you will be

907
00:30:07,190 --> 00:30:05,840
joining this network and you will be

908
00:30:09,110 --> 00:30:07,200
working with people

909
00:30:11,029 --> 00:30:09,120
on this side i hate when they always say

910
00:30:13,669 --> 00:30:11,039
side thing but with the living

911
00:30:15,269 --> 00:30:13,679
and with whatever this extended realm is

912
00:30:16,710 --> 00:30:15,279
right i mean that's part of the thing

913
00:30:18,630 --> 00:30:16,720
that's what she said she named some of

914
00:30:21,350 --> 00:30:18,640
them almost montague king

915
00:30:23,430 --> 00:30:21,360
who is a a researcher of mediums and

916
00:30:25,669 --> 00:30:23,440
parapsychology in england

917
00:30:27,909 --> 00:30:25,679
and ironically he had passed away within

918
00:30:30,470 --> 00:30:27,919
days of brandon's passing

919
00:30:31,750 --> 00:30:30,480
but he did very good work at the time

920
00:30:34,149 --> 00:30:31,760
she i can't remember who

921
00:30:35,510 --> 00:30:34,159
else she mentioned maybe some others but

922
00:30:37,269 --> 00:30:35,520
she said you know it's a

923
00:30:38,950 --> 00:30:37,279
the network is comprised of people who

924
00:30:40,070 --> 00:30:38,960
are here long ago and people on the

925
00:30:41,909 --> 00:30:40,080
earth today

926
00:30:43,510 --> 00:30:41,919
that uh are involved and interested in

927
00:30:45,510 --> 00:30:43,520
this work but they always pick people of

928
00:30:47,590 --> 00:30:45,520
integrity is what she said

929
00:30:48,789 --> 00:30:47,600
and i have met a number of people both

930
00:30:51,029 --> 00:30:48,799
the researchers and

931
00:30:51,990 --> 00:30:51,039
these top mediums since then like i know

932
00:30:54,230 --> 00:30:52,000
gary i know

933
00:30:55,190 --> 00:30:54,240
trisha robertson who you had on not too

934
00:30:57,029 --> 00:30:55,200
long ago

935
00:30:58,950 --> 00:30:57,039
she was the president of the scottish

936
00:30:59,990 --> 00:30:58,960
society for psychical research which is

937
00:31:03,190 --> 00:31:00,000
a branch of

938
00:31:06,230 --> 00:31:03,200
spr out of london i i knew

939
00:31:07,830 --> 00:31:06,240
a guy lion playfair who's passed within

940
00:31:11,430 --> 00:31:07,840
the last year or so

941
00:31:14,710 --> 00:31:11,440
he was in the spr and uh john poynton

942
00:31:17,190 --> 00:31:14,720
who was president of the spr um julie

943
00:31:19,029 --> 00:31:17,200
baisho and others and then in the medium

944
00:31:20,070 --> 00:31:19,039
realms i mean

945
00:31:21,750 --> 00:31:20,080
and some of these have been really

946
00:31:23,110 --> 00:31:21,760
helpful to helping parents heal too and

947
00:31:24,870 --> 00:31:23,120
i can talk when we get to that about

948
00:31:25,669 --> 00:31:24,880
what differentiates our group from

949
00:31:29,110 --> 00:31:25,679
others but

950
00:31:31,350 --> 00:31:29,120
you know like gordon smith uk highly

951
00:31:32,710 --> 00:31:31,360
highly recognized guy very high

952
00:31:35,509 --> 00:31:32,720
integrity person

953
00:31:37,190 --> 00:31:35,519
very gifted suzanne geezman who you've

954
00:31:40,230 --> 00:31:37,200
had on the show

955
00:31:43,110 --> 00:31:40,240
dive into helping parents heal

956
00:31:43,830 --> 00:31:43,120
for a minute what is unique what are you

957
00:31:45,909 --> 00:31:43,840
guys

958
00:31:47,430 --> 00:31:45,919
doing here's how this whole thing

959
00:31:50,149 --> 00:31:47,440
started it's kind of wacky

960
00:31:50,630 --> 00:31:50,159
but now i'm a few years into this think

961
00:31:53,990 --> 00:31:50,640
back

962
00:31:56,310 --> 00:31:54,000
this is like 2010 or so and i had

963
00:31:57,590 --> 00:31:56,320
soul shift out by now and i started to

964
00:31:59,430 --> 00:31:57,600
do some

965
00:32:00,630 --> 00:31:59,440
talks and workshops and stuff and some

966
00:32:01,990 --> 00:32:00,640
of the mediums i met

967
00:32:04,149 --> 00:32:02,000
actually invited me hey we want to do a

968
00:32:05,590 --> 00:32:04,159
workshop together you give a talk and

969
00:32:07,269 --> 00:32:05,600
then we'll do training

970
00:32:09,110 --> 00:32:07,279
you know and i was actually using some

971
00:32:10,870 --> 00:32:09,120
of my dad's material out of your psychic

972
00:32:12,789 --> 00:32:10,880
potential that book kind of boiling it

973
00:32:15,430 --> 00:32:12,799
down into key elements for people

974
00:32:15,830 --> 00:32:15,440
who wanted to try and develop so i'm

975
00:32:18,789 --> 00:32:15,840
doing

976
00:32:19,909 --> 00:32:18,799
a talk with a jamie clark who's one of

977
00:32:22,470 --> 00:32:19,919
the mediums

978
00:32:23,990 --> 00:32:22,480
mentioned in soul shift and during that

979
00:32:25,590 --> 00:32:24,000
there's a break and this woman comes up

980
00:32:27,029 --> 00:32:25,600
to me and she goes oh hi i just moved

981
00:32:28,950 --> 00:32:27,039
here from florida and i'm trying to

982
00:32:30,789 --> 00:32:28,960
network and meet new people

983
00:32:32,230 --> 00:32:30,799
her name was suzanne wilson and she's

984
00:32:34,630 --> 00:32:32,240
fairly big now

985
00:32:36,389 --> 00:32:34,640
but she uh she said well it's ironic you

986
00:32:37,110 --> 00:32:36,399
know about your son because i just met a

987
00:32:39,190 --> 00:32:37,120
woman and

988
00:32:40,630 --> 00:32:39,200
gave arena this woman named elizabeth

989
00:32:42,230 --> 00:32:40,640
boyson and her son

990
00:32:44,070 --> 00:32:42,240
died on a mountain as well but it was in

991
00:32:45,350 --> 00:32:44,080
the himalayas he was on a field trip to

992
00:32:47,509 --> 00:32:45,360
the university of arizona

993
00:32:49,509 --> 00:32:47,519
actually he was a cheerleader for the

994
00:32:50,950 --> 00:32:49,519
football team on the cheer squad

995
00:32:53,029 --> 00:32:50,960
and he went on this trip and they

996
00:32:56,389 --> 00:32:53,039
basically took them up the mountain too

997
00:32:58,310 --> 00:32:56,399
fast he got altitude sickness and died

998
00:33:00,470 --> 00:32:58,320
so i said well you know what let me uh

999
00:33:03,029 --> 00:33:00,480
give you a book to give to her as a gift

1000
00:33:04,789 --> 00:33:03,039
so i gave her a signed copy two days

1001
00:33:06,230 --> 00:33:04,799
later i got a call from elizabeth and

1002
00:33:07,750 --> 00:33:06,240
she said i've read your book already i

1003
00:33:08,870 --> 00:33:07,760
love that i'd like to meet you and your

1004
00:33:11,990 --> 00:33:08,880
wife

1005
00:33:14,870 --> 00:33:12,000
so we got together and she said hey i um

1006
00:33:15,509 --> 00:33:14,880
i'm doing a group meeting i put together

1007
00:33:17,990 --> 00:33:15,519
this group

1008
00:33:18,630 --> 00:33:18,000
you know here in uh scottsdale cave

1009
00:33:20,870 --> 00:33:18,640
creek

1010
00:33:21,830 --> 00:33:20,880
area for parents who've been through

1011
00:33:23,350 --> 00:33:21,840
this because she went to

1012
00:33:25,190 --> 00:33:23,360
i'm not going to name the organization's

1013
00:33:27,750 --> 00:33:25,200
name but another organization

1014
00:33:29,029 --> 00:33:27,760
for a brief parents that was much larger

1015
00:33:30,789 --> 00:33:29,039
and she said that it was just so

1016
00:33:31,830 --> 00:33:30,799
depressing because the people i saw

1017
00:33:33,269 --> 00:33:31,840
people that were there that have been

1018
00:33:35,669 --> 00:33:33,279
going for 10 years and

1019
00:33:36,870 --> 00:33:35,679
all they do is dwell on how bad things

1020
00:33:38,870 --> 00:33:36,880
are and what happened

1021
00:33:40,470 --> 00:33:38,880
and just coming back to the same place

1022
00:33:41,990 --> 00:33:40,480
they're not really healing

1023
00:33:44,070 --> 00:33:42,000
so i wanted to have kind of a different

1024
00:33:44,950 --> 00:33:44,080
vibe so she invited me to be her first

1025
00:33:46,710 --> 00:33:44,960
speaker

1026
00:33:48,070 --> 00:33:46,720
so i go to this meeting there's like 30

1027
00:33:50,549 --> 00:33:48,080
people there

1028
00:33:52,310 --> 00:33:50,559
and it actually was very uplifting and

1029
00:33:53,110 --> 00:33:52,320
some people got stuff off their chest or

1030
00:33:54,710 --> 00:33:53,120
whatever

1031
00:33:56,389 --> 00:33:54,720
there were two fundamentalist christians

1032
00:33:58,149 --> 00:33:56,399
that showed up

1033
00:33:59,509 --> 00:33:58,159
trying to convert people i guess to get

1034
00:34:00,310 --> 00:33:59,519
them to go to their church while we were

1035
00:34:02,470 --> 00:34:00,320
there but

1036
00:34:04,389 --> 00:34:02,480
i knew enough biblical stuff to be able

1037
00:34:05,029 --> 00:34:04,399
to talk through their arguments and

1038
00:34:07,750 --> 00:34:05,039
things and

1039
00:34:08,389 --> 00:34:07,760
eventually it's like hey look people are

1040
00:34:09,990 --> 00:34:08,399
here

1041
00:34:11,990 --> 00:34:10,000
because they need this you don't need to

1042
00:34:13,270 --> 00:34:12,000
be here trying to recruit

1043
00:34:14,950 --> 00:34:13,280
but the meeting on the whole was very

1044
00:34:16,389 --> 00:34:14,960
good elizabeth then started doing these

1045
00:34:19,190 --> 00:34:16,399
meetings once a month

1046
00:34:20,389 --> 00:34:19,200
and i went to them as often as i could

1047
00:34:24,149 --> 00:34:20,399
fast forward maybe

1048
00:34:25,589 --> 00:34:24,159
six to 12 months um i'm leaving a job in

1049
00:34:26,550 --> 00:34:25,599
the corporate world at the time and

1050
00:34:27,829 --> 00:34:26,560
trying to figure out what i'm going to

1051
00:34:29,190 --> 00:34:27,839
do next

1052
00:34:31,190 --> 00:34:29,200
and i'm still in the corporate role by

1053
00:34:32,230 --> 00:34:31,200
the way unfortunately but not for much

1054
00:34:34,950 --> 00:34:32,240
longer

1055
00:34:35,909 --> 00:34:34,960
but my uh um another medium friend tina

1056
00:34:37,750 --> 00:34:35,919
powers who you

1057
00:34:39,270 --> 00:34:37,760
may have read about in uh messages from

1058
00:34:41,829 --> 00:34:39,280
the afterlife very gifted

1059
00:34:42,550 --> 00:34:41,839
wonderful person she's talking to me she

1060
00:34:44,710 --> 00:34:42,560
was mark

1061
00:34:45,990 --> 00:34:44,720
i think really your main purpose in life

1062
00:34:48,230 --> 00:34:46,000
is to help other parents

1063
00:34:49,270 --> 00:34:48,240
who have lost kids and maybe think about

1064
00:34:51,109 --> 00:34:49,280
how you could have some sort of

1065
00:34:53,349 --> 00:34:51,119
organization to do that

1066
00:34:54,869 --> 00:34:53,359
so that was kind of my trigger and then

1067
00:34:57,349 --> 00:34:54,879
i thought well you know

1068
00:34:58,630 --> 00:34:57,359
there is a need for that on a big scale

1069
00:35:00,829 --> 00:34:58,640
you know elizabeth's

1070
00:35:03,109 --> 00:35:00,839
meetings work well but it's just one

1071
00:35:04,630 --> 00:35:03,119
location so that instead of reinventing

1072
00:35:05,670 --> 00:35:04,640
the wheel why don't i just talk to her

1073
00:35:06,390 --> 00:35:05,680
you know really what we need is a

1074
00:35:09,589 --> 00:35:06,400
website

1075
00:35:11,190 --> 00:35:09,599
a newsletter some other resources

1076
00:35:12,870 --> 00:35:11,200
and then to blueprint what she does and

1077
00:35:14,710 --> 00:35:12,880
take it out so i contacted her and i

1078
00:35:17,589 --> 00:35:14,720
said hey do you want to try this

1079
00:35:19,670 --> 00:35:17,599
on a bigger scale and so long before we

1080
00:35:21,829 --> 00:35:19,680
she agreed she was excited

1081
00:35:23,510 --> 00:35:21,839
at the time she had the organization's

1082
00:35:24,790 --> 00:35:23,520
name was parents united and lost and

1083
00:35:25,270 --> 00:35:24,800
they said how about helping parents

1084
00:35:27,910 --> 00:35:25,280
she'll

1085
00:35:29,190 --> 00:35:27,920
heal and she said oh i love that so

1086
00:35:31,109 --> 00:35:29,200
that's what we did you know

1087
00:35:33,750 --> 00:35:31,119
i built the initial website using some

1088
00:35:35,750 --> 00:35:33,760
template and then uh

1089
00:35:37,510 --> 00:35:35,760
we started a newsletter and then it

1090
00:35:39,349 --> 00:35:37,520
expanded we put a board together and

1091
00:35:41,030 --> 00:35:39,359
this thing just grew like wildfire to

1092
00:35:43,589 --> 00:35:41,040
where it is now

1093
00:35:44,310 --> 00:35:43,599
and you can ask other questions but i

1094
00:35:46,790 --> 00:35:44,320
could tell you

1095
00:35:48,150 --> 00:35:46,800
what the main differentiators are well i

1096
00:35:51,190 --> 00:35:48,160
think there's a couple of different

1097
00:35:53,349 --> 00:35:51,200
uh questions to ask like you mentioned

1098
00:35:54,630 --> 00:35:53,359
julie beischel and i've known julie for

1099
00:35:55,750 --> 00:35:54,640
a long time she's been on this show

1100
00:35:56,630 --> 00:35:55,760
multiple times and i think she's

1101
00:35:59,109 --> 00:35:56,640
fantastic

1102
00:36:00,150 --> 00:35:59,119
winbridge institute she left university

1103
00:36:02,870 --> 00:36:00,160
arizona

1104
00:36:03,430 --> 00:36:02,880
working under gary schwartz and wanted

1105
00:36:05,670 --> 00:36:03,440
to do

1106
00:36:06,470 --> 00:36:05,680
solid research on after death

1107
00:36:09,030 --> 00:36:06,480
communication

1108
00:36:11,109 --> 00:36:09,040
one of her findings which is all about

1109
00:36:11,589 --> 00:36:11,119
what you guys at helping parents heal is

1110
00:36:14,390 --> 00:36:11,599
about

1111
00:36:15,430 --> 00:36:14,400
is that grief is something we've studied

1112
00:36:17,510 --> 00:36:15,440
for a long time

1113
00:36:19,109 --> 00:36:17,520
it's a health care issue there's

1114
00:36:21,990 --> 00:36:19,119
millions and hundreds of millions of

1115
00:36:25,030 --> 00:36:22,000
dollars spent on counseling and all that

1116
00:36:28,150 --> 00:36:25,040
if you look at the efficacy

1117
00:36:31,190 --> 00:36:28,160
of a medium reading for

1118
00:36:32,310 --> 00:36:31,200
grief it's highly significant so if you

1119
00:36:35,190 --> 00:36:32,320
want to take it

1120
00:36:36,790 --> 00:36:35,200
strictly from a science standpoint

1121
00:36:39,750 --> 00:36:36,800
there's a lot there

1122
00:36:39,990 --> 00:36:39,760
but there's this gap between what people

1123
00:36:43,030 --> 00:36:40,000
who

1124
00:36:44,870 --> 00:36:43,040
might have experienced this grief a

1125
00:36:46,950 --> 00:36:44,880
knowledge gap between what they might

1126
00:36:49,589 --> 00:36:46,960
know and feelings they might have

1127
00:36:51,190 --> 00:36:49,599
about gee you know i've heard about that

1128
00:36:53,270 --> 00:36:51,200
or i have a friend who's done that

1129
00:36:54,950 --> 00:36:53,280
that sounds kind of wacky oh that goes

1130
00:36:56,870 --> 00:36:54,960
against my religious beliefs

1131
00:36:58,630 --> 00:36:56,880
that could be a scam all the rest that

1132
00:37:00,870 --> 00:36:58,640
stuff one of the

1133
00:37:02,310 --> 00:37:00,880
purposes of what you're doing is to kind

1134
00:37:05,270 --> 00:37:02,320
of close that gap

1135
00:37:07,109 --> 00:37:05,280
and point people towards some of the

1136
00:37:09,030 --> 00:37:07,119
real information that's out there in

1137
00:37:09,750 --> 00:37:09,040
terms of the healing that can come

1138
00:37:13,430 --> 00:37:09,760
through

1139
00:37:15,510 --> 00:37:13,440
these readings right right so

1140
00:37:17,670 --> 00:37:15,520
there are i kind of come up with i call

1141
00:37:20,150 --> 00:37:17,680
five pillars of healings but one of them

1142
00:37:21,430 --> 00:37:20,160
is hope and that's what's missing from

1143
00:37:21,990 --> 00:37:21,440
these other organizations because they

1144
00:37:23,589 --> 00:37:22,000
don't allow

1145
00:37:25,349 --> 00:37:23,599
discussion about these topics or

1146
00:37:27,910 --> 00:37:25,359
people's personal experiences

1147
00:37:29,910 --> 00:37:27,920
a lot of people will have their own adc

1148
00:37:31,270 --> 00:37:29,920
they'll have some sort of visitation

1149
00:37:32,710 --> 00:37:31,280
and they want to share this with other

1150
00:37:35,109 --> 00:37:32,720
people but they aren't allowed in these

1151
00:37:37,349 --> 00:37:35,119
other forums so we openly embrace that

1152
00:37:38,710 --> 00:37:37,359
we don't have any dogma we don't you

1153
00:37:40,550 --> 00:37:38,720
know we embrace people whether they're

1154
00:37:43,030 --> 00:37:40,560
atheists or jehovah witnesses not that

1155
00:37:45,349 --> 00:37:43,040
one would come to us

1156
00:37:46,069 --> 00:37:45,359
you know any any background it's it's

1157
00:37:47,270 --> 00:37:46,079
really about

1158
00:37:49,589 --> 00:37:47,280
people who have been through this

1159
00:37:49,990 --> 00:37:49,599
helping each other you know part of that

1160
00:37:53,030 --> 00:37:50,000
comes

1161
00:37:54,950 --> 00:37:53,040
from hopefully people heal if they have

1162
00:37:56,310 --> 00:37:54,960
a supportive family network that doesn't

1163
00:37:58,870 --> 00:37:56,320
always happen

1164
00:38:00,310 --> 00:37:58,880
and um you know the next thing is having

1165
00:38:02,710 --> 00:38:00,320
people around that have been through the

1166
00:38:05,510 --> 00:38:02,720
same thing that they can relate to

1167
00:38:06,150 --> 00:38:05,520
a third one is service providing service

1168
00:38:09,190 --> 00:38:06,160
to others

1169
00:38:11,589 --> 00:38:09,200
heals you too people aren't always

1170
00:38:14,069 --> 00:38:11,599
immediately able to do that but when

1171
00:38:16,150 --> 00:38:14,079
they can it will help bring it around

1172
00:38:17,670 --> 00:38:16,160
the next is guilt and you know letting

1173
00:38:19,829 --> 00:38:17,680
go of guilt and

1174
00:38:21,349 --> 00:38:19,839
anger towards others or towards yourself

1175
00:38:23,349 --> 00:38:21,359
because i guarantee you

1176
00:38:24,630 --> 00:38:23,359
90 of people who have a loved one past

1177
00:38:26,790 --> 00:38:24,640
blame themselves

1178
00:38:28,870 --> 00:38:26,800
just like elaine pagels did and it's

1179
00:38:30,230 --> 00:38:28,880
it's irrational but you do it anyhow you

1180
00:38:32,150 --> 00:38:30,240
know

1181
00:38:33,510 --> 00:38:32,160
so letting go of that guilt forgiving

1182
00:38:36,230 --> 00:38:33,520
others uh who

1183
00:38:37,510 --> 00:38:36,240
you may feel are had a hand in the

1184
00:38:39,589 --> 00:38:37,520
passing of your loved one

1185
00:38:41,430 --> 00:38:39,599
either directly or indirectly and then

1186
00:38:42,550 --> 00:38:41,440
the last one is hope peace and the hope

1187
00:38:44,950 --> 00:38:42,560
comes

1188
00:38:45,750 --> 00:38:44,960
in our view from what we've seen from

1189
00:38:47,990 --> 00:38:45,760
people thinking

1190
00:38:49,670 --> 00:38:48,000
or understanding there's more than just

1191
00:38:52,790 --> 00:38:49,680
physical reality

1192
00:38:54,470 --> 00:38:52,800
and that um their kid does go on in some

1193
00:38:56,310 --> 00:38:54,480
other form and some other way

1194
00:38:58,150 --> 00:38:56,320
maybe we can't explain that to the

1195
00:39:01,430 --> 00:38:58,160
degree that that we like

1196
00:39:03,589 --> 00:39:01,440
but that hope element's huge and so

1197
00:39:05,510 --> 00:39:03,599
um having sharing information whether

1198
00:39:07,030 --> 00:39:05,520
it's on ndes and all the research and

1199
00:39:08,470 --> 00:39:07,040
books available on that

1200
00:39:10,390 --> 00:39:08,480
you know my my background and

1201
00:39:11,750 --> 00:39:10,400
understanding my area of expertise is

1202
00:39:13,510 --> 00:39:11,760
more with the medium stuff

1203
00:39:15,430 --> 00:39:13,520
i love the nde stuff and it's probably

1204
00:39:16,710 --> 00:39:15,440
even a better

1205
00:39:19,030 --> 00:39:16,720
tool for that but the thing is not

1206
00:39:21,829 --> 00:39:19,040
everybody's going to have an nde

1207
00:39:23,349 --> 00:39:21,839
but people anybody could see a medium

1208
00:39:24,550 --> 00:39:23,359
but the other part that comes in there

1209
00:39:26,470 --> 00:39:24,560
is you have to make sure they're getting

1210
00:39:27,829 --> 00:39:26,480
a qualified medium

1211
00:39:29,510 --> 00:39:27,839
because there are a lot of people that

1212
00:39:30,870 --> 00:39:29,520
are not gifted and they think they are

1213
00:39:32,550 --> 00:39:30,880
they're just kidding themselves and

1214
00:39:35,510 --> 00:39:32,560
there's frauds out there too i've

1215
00:39:35,990 --> 00:39:35,520
actually encountered that and it's very

1216
00:39:37,670 --> 00:39:36,000
very

1217
00:39:39,670 --> 00:39:37,680
frustrating um and that's what the

1218
00:39:42,790 --> 00:39:39,680
skeptics the debunkers

1219
00:39:44,310 --> 00:39:42,800
cling to and jump all over uh you know

1220
00:39:46,069 --> 00:39:44,320
they'll say oh they're just using

1221
00:39:47,670 --> 00:39:46,079
people and they're using these very poor

1222
00:39:50,150 --> 00:39:47,680
bereaved people

1223
00:39:51,270 --> 00:39:50,160
like we're stupid or something and

1224
00:39:53,190 --> 00:39:51,280
that's why

1225
00:39:54,950 --> 00:39:53,200
you know i actually set up my own medium

1226
00:39:56,710 --> 00:39:54,960
certification program

1227
00:39:59,390 --> 00:39:56,720
and for any mediums that are going to be

1228
00:40:02,710 --> 00:39:59,400
as affiliated as a provider on

1229
00:40:04,790 --> 00:40:02,720
hph they have to go through this process

1230
00:40:06,870 --> 00:40:04,800
and i'm not astringent as julie weisha

1231
00:40:09,670 --> 00:40:06,880
would be that's not my purpose i

1232
00:40:10,870 --> 00:40:09,680
i personally know that this phenomenon

1233
00:40:12,790 --> 00:40:10,880
exists it's real

1234
00:40:15,030 --> 00:40:12,800
and there are people that are good at it

1235
00:40:16,470 --> 00:40:15,040
so i come from that standpoint

1236
00:40:18,550 --> 00:40:16,480
i'm just trying to separate the wheat

1237
00:40:20,309 --> 00:40:18,560
from the chest so that people who

1238
00:40:21,910 --> 00:40:20,319
are bereaved are not going to somebody

1239
00:40:22,870 --> 00:40:21,920
who's either not who's either

1240
00:40:25,829 --> 00:40:22,880
unqualified

1241
00:40:27,270 --> 00:40:25,839
or is out for the wrong reasons yeah i

1242
00:40:27,589 --> 00:40:27,280
was going to bring that up cut i think

1243
00:40:29,190 --> 00:40:27,599
that

1244
00:40:33,150 --> 00:40:29,200
not actually not those points but some

1245
00:40:37,109 --> 00:40:34,870
findacertifiedmedium.com

1246
00:40:38,710 --> 00:40:37,119
is a really important service in a

1247
00:40:41,750 --> 00:40:38,720
couple of ways

1248
00:40:44,950 --> 00:40:41,760
one what i've experienced and i am like

1249
00:40:46,630 --> 00:40:44,960
so tangential to the stuff

1250
00:40:48,470 --> 00:40:46,640
that you're talking about but i do get

1251
00:40:50,390 --> 00:40:48,480
people on a regular basis who

1252
00:40:52,630 --> 00:40:50,400
email me and want to know about the

1253
00:40:53,910 --> 00:40:52,640
medium thing and you overcome two of the

1254
00:40:55,910 --> 00:40:53,920
problems which is one

1255
00:40:58,550 --> 00:40:55,920
a lot of people when they get to that

1256
00:41:00,309 --> 00:40:58,560
point they've gone through a lot of

1257
00:41:02,390 --> 00:41:00,319
work already to get to the point where

1258
00:41:04,470 --> 00:41:02,400
they can even think about reaching out

1259
00:41:05,510 --> 00:41:04,480
to a medium and then i can only imagine

1260
00:41:06,950 --> 00:41:05,520
in your situation

1261
00:41:08,950 --> 00:41:06,960
where you're dealing with people with

1262
00:41:11,109 --> 00:41:08,960
this and tremendous loss you know

1263
00:41:12,630 --> 00:41:11,119
so it's a huge thing for them and then

1264
00:41:15,030 --> 00:41:12,640
they go out it's like

1265
00:41:16,230 --> 00:41:15,040
okay i'm gonna go look at here's a

1266
00:41:19,430 --> 00:41:16,240
medium and it's

1267
00:41:22,630 --> 00:41:19,440
300 400 a session and

1268
00:41:24,550 --> 00:41:22,640
the um book for the next two years and i

1269
00:41:26,950 --> 00:41:24,560
read on your site that that's one of the

1270
00:41:28,630 --> 00:41:26,960
one of the things that you saw was you

1271
00:41:30,309 --> 00:41:28,640
want to tackle it's like hey there's a

1272
00:41:32,230 --> 00:41:30,319
lot of good mediums out there

1273
00:41:33,910 --> 00:41:32,240
they you can sit down with them in a

1274
00:41:35,349 --> 00:41:33,920
relatively short period of time and it

1275
00:41:37,750 --> 00:41:35,359
doesn't have to be

1276
00:41:39,990 --> 00:41:37,760
outrageously expensive kind of thing

1277
00:41:42,470 --> 00:41:40,000
right i mean am i do i have that right

1278
00:41:43,270 --> 00:41:42,480
that's exactly why i did it because i

1279
00:41:45,430 --> 00:41:43,280
know some

1280
00:41:47,270 --> 00:41:45,440
excellent mediums that are you know like

1281
00:41:48,230 --> 00:41:47,280
celebrity mediums are well known well

1282
00:41:50,230 --> 00:41:48,240
regarded

1283
00:41:51,670 --> 00:41:50,240
and some of them are just phenomenal but

1284
00:41:52,710 --> 00:41:51,680
like you said they may have a two year

1285
00:41:54,470 --> 00:41:52,720
wait list

1286
00:41:56,470 --> 00:41:54,480
and some charge a lot and part of the

1287
00:41:57,829 --> 00:41:56,480
reason i'm not going to justify what

1288
00:41:58,390 --> 00:41:57,839
they charge it's up to them what they

1289
00:42:00,230 --> 00:41:58,400
want to check

1290
00:42:01,430 --> 00:42:00,240
exactly who cares i hate even getting

1291
00:42:02,790 --> 00:42:01,440
into that stuff why haven't people

1292
00:42:04,630 --> 00:42:02,800
talking you charge what you want it's

1293
00:42:06,550 --> 00:42:04,640
abyss it's a market

1294
00:42:08,230 --> 00:42:06,560
yeah and and some of them it's very

1295
00:42:09,750 --> 00:42:08,240
draining there's one i just learned

1296
00:42:11,510 --> 00:42:09,760
about i haven't read from but i

1297
00:42:13,190 --> 00:42:11,520
trust the people who i know carolyn

1298
00:42:15,990 --> 00:42:13,200
clapper charges a lot but

1299
00:42:17,510 --> 00:42:16,000
she's phenomenal um allison was

1300
00:42:20,069 --> 00:42:17,520
phenomenal you know there's a lot of

1301
00:42:23,190 --> 00:42:20,079
folks out there john edwards phenomenal

1302
00:42:25,190 --> 00:42:23,200
but they have you know limited capacity

1303
00:42:27,349 --> 00:42:25,200
um it takes a lot out of them and some

1304
00:42:28,870 --> 00:42:27,359
role like carolyn does one per day

1305
00:42:30,550 --> 00:42:28,880
because that's all she can physically

1306
00:42:32,470 --> 00:42:30,560
handle um

1307
00:42:34,309 --> 00:42:32,480
so i needed to find other resources for

1308
00:42:36,470 --> 00:42:34,319
people that were more affordable

1309
00:42:37,349 --> 00:42:36,480
and that were vetted and that had

1310
00:42:39,430 --> 00:42:37,359
availability

1311
00:42:41,510 --> 00:42:39,440
and so i think i'm up over 30 of them

1312
00:42:43,430 --> 00:42:41,520
now and we're constantly testing it's

1313
00:42:46,390 --> 00:42:43,440
amazing

1314
00:42:47,750 --> 00:42:46,400
how often we're getting people want to

1315
00:42:49,190 --> 00:42:47,760
apply for it it's

1316
00:42:51,750 --> 00:42:49,200
i think it's getting better known out

1317
00:42:53,510 --> 00:42:51,760
there and we do need more sitters too so

1318
00:42:54,309 --> 00:42:53,520
if anyone wants to volunteer as a test

1319
00:42:56,470 --> 00:42:54,319
sitter

1320
00:42:58,230 --> 00:42:56,480
i'm totally open to that but there are

1321
00:42:59,750 --> 00:42:58,240
responsibilities that come with it and

1322
00:43:00,950 --> 00:42:59,760
some people are all excited to get the

1323
00:43:02,630 --> 00:43:00,960
free reading but they don't want to do

1324
00:43:05,030 --> 00:43:02,640
the back end work

1325
00:43:05,990 --> 00:43:05,040
so if they're interested in this they

1326
00:43:08,309 --> 00:43:06,000
can go to my website

1327
00:43:09,670 --> 00:43:08,319
hit my contact link and write me but

1328
00:43:11,510 --> 00:43:09,680
here's what i'm looking for you're going

1329
00:43:13,670 --> 00:43:11,520
to have to sit through

1330
00:43:14,710 --> 00:43:13,680
you know one or more readings you're

1331
00:43:15,670 --> 00:43:14,720
going to have to it's going to be

1332
00:43:16,950 --> 00:43:15,680
recorded

1333
00:43:17,990 --> 00:43:16,960
you're going to have to transcribe it

1334
00:43:19,430 --> 00:43:18,000
when it's done and then you're going to

1335
00:43:21,190 --> 00:43:19,440
have to grade it and that means going

1336
00:43:21,990 --> 00:43:21,200
through statement by statement to note

1337
00:43:24,390 --> 00:43:22,000
if it's

1338
00:43:25,750 --> 00:43:24,400
correct incorrect or it's an

1339
00:43:27,829 --> 00:43:25,760
indeterminable statement

1340
00:43:29,670 --> 00:43:27,839
and if it's a bonus statement like okay

1341
00:43:31,910 --> 00:43:29,680
you got my son's birthday you name

1342
00:43:34,470 --> 00:43:31,920
my son you said his favorite pizza with

1343
00:43:37,109 --> 00:43:34,480
pepperoni and olive you know whatever

1344
00:43:37,990 --> 00:43:37,119
um that's what's required on the back

1345
00:43:39,829 --> 00:43:38,000
end

1346
00:43:42,150 --> 00:43:39,839
so if anyone's interested hey we need

1347
00:43:46,150 --> 00:43:42,160
more sitters maybe we'll do that

1348
00:43:47,430 --> 00:43:46,160
as an episode on uh skeptico awesome

1349
00:43:49,750 --> 00:43:47,440
because then i think that would draw

1350
00:43:50,870 --> 00:43:49,760
attention to it and i think it also

1351
00:43:53,349 --> 00:43:50,880
would

1352
00:43:54,390 --> 00:43:53,359
kind of reveal the protocol behind this

1353
00:43:55,829 --> 00:43:54,400
that you use

1354
00:43:57,750 --> 00:43:55,839
so real quickly i got a bunch of

1355
00:44:01,190 --> 00:43:57,760
skeptical questions i want to get into

1356
00:44:03,270 --> 00:44:01,200
but let's not leave this topic before

1357
00:44:04,390 --> 00:44:03,280
because you just kind of touched on it

1358
00:44:07,190 --> 00:44:04,400
what about

1359
00:44:08,630 --> 00:44:07,200
uh like you were just mentioning do's

1360
00:44:10,790 --> 00:44:08,640
don'ts advice

1361
00:44:12,950 --> 00:44:10,800
for a medium reading but you were

1362
00:44:16,150 --> 00:44:12,960
talking about it in terms of

1363
00:44:17,430 --> 00:44:16,160
the protocol you guys use in kind of

1364
00:44:19,349 --> 00:44:17,440
judging these mediums

1365
00:44:21,829 --> 00:44:19,359
what about in general what do you tell

1366
00:44:24,390 --> 00:44:21,839
people when they're considering going

1367
00:44:25,750 --> 00:44:24,400
and having that sitting and

1368
00:44:27,750 --> 00:44:25,760
and and what do you tell them to get the

1369
00:44:30,150 --> 00:44:27,760
most out of it

1370
00:44:31,030 --> 00:44:30,160
well first off pick somebody who's been

1371
00:44:32,790 --> 00:44:31,040
validated

1372
00:44:34,630 --> 00:44:32,800
that either you personally know someone

1373
00:44:36,630 --> 00:44:34,640
who's gone and trust or

1374
00:44:37,829 --> 00:44:36,640
a list like mine but make sure you're

1375
00:44:40,630 --> 00:44:37,839
going to somebody who

1376
00:44:41,270 --> 00:44:40,640
who has good references i'd say when you

1377
00:44:43,109 --> 00:44:41,280
go there

1378
00:44:44,470 --> 00:44:43,119
do your best if you can for them not to

1379
00:44:46,710 --> 00:44:44,480
be front loaded with any

1380
00:44:48,069 --> 00:44:46,720
information about you i hate to be

1381
00:44:49,670 --> 00:44:48,079
deceitful but you know if they don't

1382
00:44:51,349 --> 00:44:49,680
even know your name that's good if you

1383
00:44:52,870 --> 00:44:51,359
could somehow make the appointment with

1384
00:44:55,349 --> 00:44:52,880
maybe a friend makes the appointment for

1385
00:44:56,630 --> 00:44:55,359
you or whatever and again i hate to use

1386
00:44:58,390 --> 00:44:56,640
trickery but

1387
00:44:59,589 --> 00:44:58,400
um you know if you're going to somebody

1388
00:45:01,030 --> 00:44:59,599
that's been vetted i don't think you

1389
00:45:02,309 --> 00:45:01,040
need to worry about it as much anybody

1390
00:45:05,109 --> 00:45:02,319
on my side's already done

1391
00:45:06,390 --> 00:45:05,119
five blinded readings themselves so you

1392
00:45:07,990 --> 00:45:06,400
can trust them

1393
00:45:10,069 --> 00:45:08,000
but i find that some people are so

1394
00:45:11,430 --> 00:45:10,079
skeptical that if they go to somebody

1395
00:45:12,150 --> 00:45:11,440
and they get good information then

1396
00:45:13,829 --> 00:45:12,160
they're gonna think

1397
00:45:15,589 --> 00:45:13,839
how did they get that they knew my name

1398
00:45:16,550 --> 00:45:15,599
or whatever so let's just interject

1399
00:45:18,870 --> 00:45:16,560
there for a minute

1400
00:45:19,589 --> 00:45:18,880
because you're kind of going over it in

1401
00:45:21,750 --> 00:45:19,599
the big picture

1402
00:45:23,270 --> 00:45:21,760
i totally get what you're saying and the

1403
00:45:25,190 --> 00:45:23,280
little bit you know that i've

1404
00:45:27,349 --> 00:45:25,200
experienced with this i give people the

1405
00:45:28,470 --> 00:45:27,359
same advice because which i think you're

1406
00:45:30,710 --> 00:45:28,480
really

1407
00:45:31,589 --> 00:45:30,720
getting at is that last part that you've

1408
00:45:34,390 --> 00:45:31,599
got right there

1409
00:45:34,950 --> 00:45:34,400
is that the most significant thing you

1410
00:45:38,390 --> 00:45:34,960
can get

1411
00:45:38,870 --> 00:45:38,400
out of that reading is validation that

1412
00:45:42,150 --> 00:45:38,880
there

1413
00:45:43,510 --> 00:45:42,160
is this extended realm and a lot of

1414
00:45:45,750 --> 00:45:43,520
people i think go in it

1415
00:45:47,190 --> 00:45:45,760
expecting or not even expecting but

1416
00:45:50,550 --> 00:45:47,200
hoping for

1417
00:45:54,309 --> 00:45:50,560
the home run kind of you know

1418
00:45:55,990 --> 00:45:54,319
huge kind of thing and i think it's much

1419
00:45:57,030 --> 00:45:56,000
better to go in and saying you know what

1420
00:46:00,150 --> 00:45:57,040
if i could get

1421
00:46:04,150 --> 00:46:00,160
validation that there really is an

1422
00:46:06,870 --> 00:46:04,160
afterlife and that my loved one is there

1423
00:46:07,430 --> 00:46:06,880
that would probably be the most and it

1424
00:46:09,430 --> 00:46:07,440
is

1425
00:46:11,910 --> 00:46:09,440
so that's why you set it up the way that

1426
00:46:13,670 --> 00:46:11,920
you do and you do it like a freaking

1427
00:46:16,150 --> 00:46:13,680
experiment so you can come through and

1428
00:46:17,670 --> 00:46:16,160
say dang i gave that person nothing

1429
00:46:19,670 --> 00:46:17,680
and they came through and gave me this

1430
00:46:21,670 --> 00:46:19,680
this this this i mean i almost think

1431
00:46:23,510 --> 00:46:21,680
anyone especially for a first reading

1432
00:46:25,270 --> 00:46:23,520
should be going in and following the

1433
00:46:25,910 --> 00:46:25,280
protocol that you use to test your

1434
00:46:27,829 --> 00:46:25,920
mediums

1435
00:46:29,109 --> 00:46:27,839
because at the end of the day i think

1436
00:46:30,630 --> 00:46:29,119
for a long time after

1437
00:46:33,109 --> 00:46:30,640
that's what you're going to reflect back

1438
00:46:34,950 --> 00:46:33,119
on and go no wait a minute i really

1439
00:46:35,510 --> 00:46:34,960
didn't give them anything and i didn't

1440
00:46:37,190 --> 00:46:35,520
answer

1441
00:46:38,870 --> 00:46:37,200
and i didn't lead them on i didn't get

1442
00:46:40,230 --> 00:46:38,880
all excited you know what i'm saying so

1443
00:46:42,069 --> 00:46:40,240
you're right that's the other part of it

1444
00:46:43,670 --> 00:46:42,079
is you know there's front loading and

1445
00:46:45,430 --> 00:46:43,680
then there's cold reading so you want to

1446
00:46:47,030 --> 00:46:45,440
avoid the potential of either so the

1447
00:46:49,190 --> 00:46:47,040
front loading is them knowing anything

1448
00:46:51,349 --> 00:46:49,200
about you before you get there

1449
00:46:52,870 --> 00:46:51,359
cold reading is a technique that's a lot

1450
00:46:55,510 --> 00:46:52,880
of debunkers claim is

1451
00:46:56,230 --> 00:46:55,520
common i know it probably happens but i

1452
00:46:58,950 --> 00:46:56,240
don't think it's

1453
00:47:00,309 --> 00:46:58,960
it's common or common with good mediums

1454
00:47:00,870 --> 00:47:00,319
and that whole idea is that they're

1455
00:47:04,309 --> 00:47:00,880
reading

1456
00:47:06,390 --> 00:47:04,319
reaction or you're feeding them

1457
00:47:09,510 --> 00:47:06,400
information without even thinking about

1458
00:47:10,069 --> 00:47:09,520
it telling them too much so you want to

1459
00:47:13,190 --> 00:47:10,079
minimize

1460
00:47:13,750 --> 00:47:13,200
your responses um not just to say yes

1461
00:47:16,470 --> 00:47:13,760
and no

1462
00:47:17,990 --> 00:47:16,480
but don't go overboard and say oh yeah

1463
00:47:20,309 --> 00:47:18,000
yeah that's my son he was

1464
00:47:22,069 --> 00:47:20,319
this tall and he wrote a skateboard

1465
00:47:22,630 --> 00:47:22,079
don't get too excited and go off there

1466
00:47:24,390 --> 00:47:22,640
just

1467
00:47:26,150 --> 00:47:24,400
try and measure that but you want to be

1468
00:47:28,069 --> 00:47:26,160
positive because it is an energetic

1469
00:47:29,670 --> 00:47:28,079
connection and the medium does feed off

1470
00:47:30,870 --> 00:47:29,680
the sitters energy

1471
00:47:32,630 --> 00:47:30,880
and they you know they need that

1472
00:47:34,230 --> 00:47:32,640
positive environment and some feedback

1473
00:47:35,670 --> 00:47:34,240
you know like hey yeah that's right

1474
00:47:37,589 --> 00:47:35,680
that that statement makes sense to me

1475
00:47:40,470 --> 00:47:37,599
thank you go on that kind of approach

1476
00:47:42,230 --> 00:47:40,480
just don't don't spill your guts and try

1477
00:47:45,910 --> 00:47:42,240
not to overreact

1478
00:47:48,470 --> 00:47:45,920
see what i always do my thing is kind of

1479
00:47:49,349 --> 00:47:48,480
related to that is up front i tell the

1480
00:47:52,630 --> 00:47:49,359
medium i say

1481
00:47:55,190 --> 00:47:52,640
look i am not here to debunk you

1482
00:47:56,870 --> 00:47:55,200
i'm totally confident that there is this

1483
00:47:59,589 --> 00:47:56,880
realm and you can connect to it

1484
00:48:01,270 --> 00:47:59,599
and then i just say for me what would be

1485
00:48:04,710 --> 00:48:01,280
most beneficial for me

1486
00:48:05,589 --> 00:48:04,720
right now is to not respond to anything

1487
00:48:07,030 --> 00:48:05,599
you're saying

1488
00:48:08,549 --> 00:48:07,040
if you're open-minded or you've read

1489
00:48:09,589 --> 00:48:08,559
books on the subject and you already

1490
00:48:11,430 --> 00:48:09,599
kind of believe

1491
00:48:13,190 --> 00:48:11,440
you may not need to go to the nth degree

1492
00:48:14,390 --> 00:48:13,200
but if you're a very skeptical person

1493
00:48:16,390 --> 00:48:14,400
and you're going to question stuff

1494
00:48:17,750 --> 00:48:16,400
after the fact then just go ahead and

1495
00:48:18,950 --> 00:48:17,760
have a friend make the appointment for

1496
00:48:20,150 --> 00:48:18,960
you and pay for you and then you can

1497
00:48:21,910 --> 00:48:20,160
reimburse them

1498
00:48:23,589 --> 00:48:21,920
and then when you get on you can reveal

1499
00:48:25,589 --> 00:48:23,599
you know hey my name is actually mark

1500
00:48:27,589 --> 00:48:25,599
steve couldn't make the call today sorry

1501
00:48:28,870 --> 00:48:27,599
i hope you're doing the reading for me

1502
00:48:30,870 --> 00:48:28,880
it's still going to go well if they're a

1503
00:48:32,230 --> 00:48:30,880
good medium so

1504
00:48:33,589 --> 00:48:32,240
i don't think that's always necessary

1505
00:48:34,870 --> 00:48:33,599
but if you're a skeptical type and

1506
00:48:35,910 --> 00:48:34,880
you're going to question the half of the

1507
00:48:37,349 --> 00:48:35,920
fact that

1508
00:48:38,870 --> 00:48:37,359
i've had people do that that have come

1509
00:48:40,150 --> 00:48:38,880
to me and said hey i want i want to go

1510
00:48:41,109 --> 00:48:40,160
to somebody good and i'll stare into

1511
00:48:42,710 --> 00:48:41,119
somebody good

1512
00:48:44,309 --> 00:48:42,720
and then they're like oh that was too

1513
00:48:46,950 --> 00:48:44,319
good you know they must

1514
00:48:47,510 --> 00:48:46,960
no they didn't but you didn't listen to

1515
00:48:49,589 --> 00:48:47,520
me

1516
00:48:52,230 --> 00:48:49,599
you know you if you're that tight that's

1517
00:48:54,150 --> 00:48:52,240
probably what you want to do

1518
00:48:56,309 --> 00:48:54,160
you know and i want to talk about a

1519
00:48:58,950 --> 00:48:56,319
little bit more about that type

1520
00:49:00,309 --> 00:48:58,960
because there is we're all different

1521
00:49:03,510 --> 00:49:00,319
types

1522
00:49:04,950 --> 00:49:03,520
and i i know this is like a little bit

1523
00:49:06,549 --> 00:49:04,960
controversial and probably piss some

1524
00:49:09,829 --> 00:49:06,559
people off but that's

1525
00:49:13,430 --> 00:49:09,839
that's okay the whole grief thing

1526
00:49:16,630 --> 00:49:13,440
is interesting to me because

1527
00:49:19,510 --> 00:49:16,640
i i i i have four kids

1528
00:49:20,790 --> 00:49:19,520
my wife and i love our kids we can't we

1529
00:49:23,589 --> 00:49:20,800
can't stand

1530
00:49:25,589 --> 00:49:23,599
the slightest little injury emotionally

1531
00:49:28,390 --> 00:49:25,599
or physically happening you know

1532
00:49:30,390 --> 00:49:28,400
so i can't imagine the loss i can't

1533
00:49:32,790 --> 00:49:30,400
imagine the grief

1534
00:49:33,510 --> 00:49:32,800
at the same time i don't do grief

1535
00:49:37,109 --> 00:49:33,520
because i

1536
00:49:38,870 --> 00:49:37,119
am so my i've it's a process it's really

1537
00:49:42,390 --> 00:49:38,880
a skeptical process

1538
00:49:44,470 --> 00:49:42,400
but i like have no doubt about the

1539
00:49:46,870 --> 00:49:44,480
survival of consciousness because of the

1540
00:49:50,230 --> 00:49:46,880
evidence because of scientific evidence

1541
00:49:52,470 --> 00:49:50,240
i have no doubt about the

1542
00:49:55,270 --> 00:49:52,480
afterlife as it's described in the dear

1543
00:49:57,510 --> 00:49:55,280
death experience and as it's described

1544
00:49:59,349 --> 00:49:57,520
from mediumistic readings although they

1545
00:50:00,549 --> 00:49:59,359
contradict i think there's a common

1546
00:50:03,910 --> 00:50:00,559
thread through there

1547
00:50:04,790 --> 00:50:03,920
so i don't want to put down anyone's

1548
00:50:07,510 --> 00:50:04,800
grief

1549
00:50:08,230 --> 00:50:07,520
but that's not me that's not what i'm

1550
00:50:11,270 --> 00:50:08,240
about

1551
00:50:14,710 --> 00:50:11,280
and i don't feel like i would totally be

1552
00:50:17,990 --> 00:50:14,720
in that mode if something happened

1553
00:50:20,309 --> 00:50:18,000
but so i just think

1554
00:50:22,069 --> 00:50:20,319
it's all part of this spiritual journey

1555
00:50:23,750 --> 00:50:22,079
i think that we enter in on

1556
00:50:26,069 --> 00:50:23,760
and i guess i just want to throw that

1557
00:50:26,630 --> 00:50:26,079
out there because i feel like that has

1558
00:50:29,829 --> 00:50:26,640
to be

1559
00:50:31,349 --> 00:50:29,839
okay too you know i love that you come

1560
00:50:33,990 --> 00:50:31,359
from a compassionate

1561
00:50:35,349 --> 00:50:34,000
heart place and that's the space that

1562
00:50:38,390 --> 00:50:35,359
you're trying to expand

1563
00:50:38,710 --> 00:50:38,400
and i am too and that can manifest in

1564
00:50:41,510 --> 00:50:38,720
you

1565
00:50:43,109 --> 00:50:41,520
one way and it can manifest in me in

1566
00:50:45,190 --> 00:50:43,119
another way of saying

1567
00:50:46,150 --> 00:50:45,200
you know i don't really resonate with

1568
00:50:49,510 --> 00:50:46,160
your

1569
00:50:51,109 --> 00:50:49,520
you know overwhelming sense of grief

1570
00:50:53,030 --> 00:50:51,119
either and that's okay that's your

1571
00:50:55,430 --> 00:50:53,040
journey but it's not my journey

1572
00:50:56,950 --> 00:50:55,440
do you get what i'm saying at all i do

1573
00:50:57,270 --> 00:50:56,960
but i think until you've been through

1574
00:51:01,430 --> 00:50:57,280
that

1575
00:51:04,390 --> 00:51:01,440
the other thing is

1576
00:51:06,230 --> 00:51:04,400
for us my wife and i healed way fast i

1577
00:51:07,829 --> 00:51:06,240
mean compared to other people

1578
00:51:08,950 --> 00:51:07,839
for a lot of people they're years into

1579
00:51:11,510 --> 00:51:08,960
this and they're still going through it

1580
00:51:14,470 --> 00:51:11,520
i'd say within two weeks we were

1581
00:51:15,589 --> 00:51:14,480
like 78 it was pretty phenomenal people

1582
00:51:17,349 --> 00:51:15,599
couldn't believe it but

1583
00:51:18,950 --> 00:51:17,359
it's because i had that knowledge in

1584
00:51:20,790 --> 00:51:18,960
that background that i do

1585
00:51:22,150 --> 00:51:20,800
just like you share that you have so i

1586
00:51:23,990 --> 00:51:22,160
think in your mind you think

1587
00:51:25,430 --> 00:51:24,000
i'm not going to agree because of that

1588
00:51:27,670 --> 00:51:25,440
but part of it is

1589
00:51:29,510 --> 00:51:27,680
there is a biological part component but

1590
00:51:31,829 --> 00:51:29,520
there's also

1591
00:51:32,790 --> 00:51:31,839
the sense that this is a major change

1592
00:51:34,069 --> 00:51:32,800
and my kid

1593
00:51:35,990 --> 00:51:34,079
i'm never going to be with them in the

1594
00:51:36,549 --> 00:51:36,000
same form they were in and not be able

1595
00:51:39,750 --> 00:51:36,559
to

1596
00:51:41,990 --> 00:51:39,760
that's a loss

1597
00:51:43,270 --> 00:51:42,000
so that part you may think you wouldn't

1598
00:51:45,109 --> 00:51:43,280
i think you would

1599
00:51:47,270 --> 00:51:45,119
but you would probably heal much faster

1600
00:51:49,109 --> 00:51:47,280
than most people

1601
00:51:51,349 --> 00:51:49,119
yeah i i hear you and maybe that came

1602
00:51:53,990 --> 00:51:51,359
off the wrong way because it's

1603
00:51:55,589 --> 00:51:54,000
i mean who it's it's not for certainly

1604
00:51:56,790 --> 00:51:55,599
not for me to say certainly not for me

1605
00:51:59,190 --> 00:51:56,800
to judge other people

1606
00:51:59,990 --> 00:51:59,200
and certainly not for me to predict how

1607
00:52:03,190 --> 00:52:00,000
i would

1608
00:52:06,150 --> 00:52:03,200
handle that situation what i'm just

1609
00:52:07,990 --> 00:52:06,160
exploring is the possibility that we

1610
00:52:08,870 --> 00:52:08,000
have to be open to the other side of

1611
00:52:11,670 --> 00:52:08,880
that too

1612
00:52:11,990 --> 00:52:11,680
which is you know let's not judge people

1613
00:52:15,190 --> 00:52:12,000
who

1614
00:52:17,349 --> 00:52:15,200
are experiencing it a different way

1615
00:52:19,109 --> 00:52:17,359
well just hanging on a little bit like

1616
00:52:20,309 --> 00:52:19,119
elizabeth boyson who's my partner in

1617
00:52:23,109 --> 00:52:20,319
this and she's president

1618
00:52:25,190 --> 00:52:23,119
of the organization she's so upbeat and

1619
00:52:26,870 --> 00:52:25,200
so positive and has been since her son

1620
00:52:30,309 --> 00:52:26,880
passed i mean right away

1621
00:52:32,630 --> 00:52:30,319
she felt him actually hug her

1622
00:52:34,470 --> 00:52:32,640
as she describes it at the time of his

1623
00:52:36,069 --> 00:52:34,480
passing like he was immediately there in

1624
00:52:38,309 --> 00:52:36,079
spirit form or whatever however you want

1625
00:52:39,190 --> 00:52:38,319
to say that but she's always so upbeat

1626
00:52:42,309 --> 00:52:39,200
people sometimes

1627
00:52:44,470 --> 00:52:42,319
question is she for real because

1628
00:52:45,430 --> 00:52:44,480
you got people that are deeply in grief

1629
00:52:46,950 --> 00:52:45,440
and i have been

1630
00:52:48,790 --> 00:52:46,960
they just don't understand how somebody

1631
00:52:50,870 --> 00:52:48,800
could get to that point

1632
00:52:52,230 --> 00:52:50,880
but you know everybody has their own

1633
00:52:55,270 --> 00:52:52,240
process and their own

1634
00:52:57,109 --> 00:52:55,280
way of dealing with stuff like that

1635
00:52:59,510 --> 00:52:57,119
i did an interview a few months back

1636
00:53:01,510 --> 00:52:59,520
with dr mark pittstick

1637
00:53:02,710 --> 00:53:01,520
who is a colleague of gary schwartz at

1638
00:53:04,230 --> 00:53:02,720
university arizona

1639
00:53:06,230 --> 00:53:04,240
and they're working on this project

1640
00:53:09,430 --> 00:53:06,240
called the soul phone

1641
00:53:11,349 --> 00:53:09,440
and i gave mark pretty hard time because

1642
00:53:12,870 --> 00:53:11,359
i i have some real issues in the way

1643
00:53:15,670 --> 00:53:12,880
that they present that

1644
00:53:16,549 --> 00:53:15,680
and the premise behind it and it it it

1645
00:53:17,910 --> 00:53:16,559
pops up again

1646
00:53:19,829 --> 00:53:17,920
even in some of the stuff that you're

1647
00:53:21,670 --> 00:53:19,839
talking about it's it's kind of this

1648
00:53:24,230 --> 00:53:21,680
god needs our help kind of thing you

1649
00:53:24,630 --> 00:53:24,240
know it's like we have to develop a cell

1650
00:53:26,870 --> 00:53:24,640
phone

1651
00:53:27,750 --> 00:53:26,880
technology so that we can communicate

1652
00:53:30,309 --> 00:53:27,760
with the dead

1653
00:53:32,309 --> 00:53:30,319
because god needs our help in developing

1654
00:53:33,430 --> 00:53:32,319
this technology for the future

1655
00:53:35,750 --> 00:53:33,440
and there's something about that that

1656
00:53:36,069 --> 00:53:35,760
just is like okay you know i can hear

1657
00:53:39,910 --> 00:53:36,079
that

1658
00:53:42,309 --> 00:53:39,920
really the case especially since

1659
00:53:43,829 --> 00:53:42,319
this kind of idea that god's needs are

1660
00:53:46,870 --> 00:53:43,839
healthy we've seen it

1661
00:53:49,910 --> 00:53:46,880
misapplied in so many different ways for

1662
00:53:50,549 --> 00:53:49,920
every war every scam artist every cult

1663
00:53:53,670 --> 00:53:50,559
leader

1664
00:53:54,390 --> 00:53:53,680
has kind of used the same thing on the

1665
00:53:57,510 --> 00:53:54,400
other hand

1666
00:54:01,910 --> 00:53:57,520
i don't discount the possibility that

1667
00:54:04,069 --> 00:54:01,920
technology is going to play a role in

1668
00:54:06,150 --> 00:54:04,079
whatever this connection we have is with

1669
00:54:09,349 --> 00:54:06,160
the extended consciousness realm

1670
00:54:10,309 --> 00:54:09,359
and if we understand or think anywhere

1671
00:54:12,549 --> 00:54:10,319
deeply about

1672
00:54:13,430 --> 00:54:12,559
near-death experience we see right off

1673
00:54:15,349 --> 00:54:13,440
the bat that there's

1674
00:54:17,069 --> 00:54:15,359
certainly a direct connection between

1675
00:54:19,670 --> 00:54:17,079
near-death experience and

1676
00:54:20,870 --> 00:54:19,680
resuscitation which is a medical

1677
00:54:23,270 --> 00:54:20,880
technology

1678
00:54:24,710 --> 00:54:23,280
more people are resuscitated than used

1679
00:54:27,030 --> 00:54:24,720
to be resuscitated

1680
00:54:29,510 --> 00:54:27,040
and there's better resuscitation so we

1681
00:54:30,230 --> 00:54:29,520
already have a technology link there to

1682
00:54:33,190 --> 00:54:30,240
deal with

1683
00:54:34,069 --> 00:54:33,200
but there are these two elements that we

1684
00:54:36,870 --> 00:54:34,079
have to kind of

1685
00:54:37,270 --> 00:54:36,880
weigh and i think that's what makes this

1686
00:54:39,510 --> 00:54:37,280
so

1687
00:54:40,549 --> 00:54:39,520
challenging if we're really willing to

1688
00:54:42,789 --> 00:54:40,559
engage

1689
00:54:44,710 --> 00:54:42,799
in the data you know and then the thing

1690
00:54:47,190 --> 00:54:44,720
that i really pushed mark on

1691
00:54:48,870 --> 00:54:47,200
was you know this is typical gary

1692
00:54:50,870 --> 00:54:48,880
schwartz i love gary schwartz

1693
00:54:52,309 --> 00:54:50,880
but he really riles a lot of people for

1694
00:54:53,990 --> 00:54:52,319
a lot of reasons

1695
00:54:56,150 --> 00:54:54,000
one of the things he comes through is

1696
00:54:57,190 --> 00:54:56,160
hey guys not only are we developing the

1697
00:54:59,349 --> 00:54:57,200
soul phone

1698
00:55:00,630 --> 00:54:59,359
but we have a whole group on the other

1699
00:55:03,750 --> 00:55:00,640
side that's helping us

1700
00:55:05,270 --> 00:55:03,760
they're the a team and like by the way

1701
00:55:07,829 --> 00:55:05,280
it includes michael jackson

1702
00:55:08,630 --> 00:55:07,839
he's an a team player isn't he and i'm

1703
00:55:10,789 --> 00:55:08,640
like

1704
00:55:13,030 --> 00:55:10,799
whoa i don't know a lot about michael

1705
00:55:14,069 --> 00:55:13,040
jackson but a little bit that i think i

1706
00:55:16,230 --> 00:55:14,079
know about

1707
00:55:17,349 --> 00:55:16,240
who he was on this side i want to put

1708
00:55:20,150 --> 00:55:17,359
him on my a

1709
00:55:21,030 --> 00:55:20,160
team so you know what what do you think

1710
00:55:23,589 --> 00:55:21,040
about

1711
00:55:24,390 --> 00:55:23,599
all of that that i just threw out there

1712
00:55:25,589 --> 00:55:24,400
i know mark

1713
00:55:27,829 --> 00:55:25,599
actually he actually has been ever

1714
00:55:29,510 --> 00:55:27,839
supportive of hph and writes articles

1715
00:55:31,910 --> 00:55:29,520
for our newsletter and so forth

1716
00:55:34,230 --> 00:55:31,920
he's a good guy but and i heard that

1717
00:55:35,109 --> 00:55:34,240
episode by the way so i got the gist of

1718
00:55:38,150 --> 00:55:35,119
it

1719
00:55:38,710 --> 00:55:38,160
i'm personally i don't think god needs

1720
00:55:40,950 --> 00:55:38,720
our help

1721
00:55:41,829 --> 00:55:40,960
i think things come together to help

1722
00:55:44,069 --> 00:55:41,839
people

1723
00:55:45,750 --> 00:55:44,079
and maybe a medium will help somebody

1724
00:55:47,670 --> 00:55:45,760
point they need it or whatever

1725
00:55:48,950 --> 00:55:47,680
do we need to go overboard in terms of

1726
00:55:50,630 --> 00:55:48,960
trying to control everything

1727
00:55:52,630 --> 00:55:50,640
i don't personally think so the cell

1728
00:55:55,349 --> 00:55:52,640
phone to me seems like a glorified

1729
00:55:57,829 --> 00:55:55,359
ouija board in a way like a mechanism

1730
00:56:02,309 --> 00:56:00,470
i don't i don't feel the same way about

1731
00:56:04,470 --> 00:56:02,319
that as i do having a

1732
00:56:05,670 --> 00:56:04,480
medium reading with somebody who's a

1733
00:56:07,829 --> 00:56:05,680
sincere

1734
00:56:09,349 --> 00:56:07,839
person as opposed to some device or

1735
00:56:10,789 --> 00:56:09,359
whatever i don't know

1736
00:56:12,549 --> 00:56:10,799
if they're able to have a breakthrough

1737
00:56:14,710 --> 00:56:12,559
and it helps folks

1738
00:56:16,470 --> 00:56:14,720
out and it does take us to the next step

1739
00:56:18,549 --> 00:56:16,480
fine it just

1740
00:56:19,990 --> 00:56:18,559
the way it's been described to me i i

1741
00:56:21,990 --> 00:56:20,000
don't know that it's

1742
00:56:23,349 --> 00:56:22,000
that it does it will do that maybe it

1743
00:56:26,470 --> 00:56:23,359
will

1744
00:56:29,829 --> 00:56:26,480
what do you think about technology

1745
00:56:31,670 --> 00:56:29,839
i'm really told that you know if i have

1746
00:56:32,069 --> 00:56:31,680
to come back to a bigger philosophical

1747
00:56:35,030 --> 00:56:32,079
view

1748
00:56:36,230 --> 00:56:35,040
of why i think we're here and and we go

1749
00:56:38,150 --> 00:56:36,240
through challenges in life

1750
00:56:39,990 --> 00:56:38,160
because i think we're here to refine

1751
00:56:43,270 --> 00:56:40,000
ourselves and to grow

1752
00:56:45,589 --> 00:56:43,280
and suffering is part of that so

1753
00:56:47,670 --> 00:56:45,599
i think we need little things to help us

1754
00:56:50,069 --> 00:56:47,680
carry on and get through

1755
00:56:51,190 --> 00:56:50,079
but i you know it's just like i'm trying

1756
00:56:53,109 --> 00:56:51,200
to think of a recent

1757
00:56:55,430 --> 00:56:53,119
interview you had where people talk

1758
00:56:57,190 --> 00:56:55,440
about suffering and challenges

1759
00:56:58,789 --> 00:56:57,200
and as though it's always a bad or

1760
00:57:01,589 --> 00:56:58,799
horrible thing and i think

1761
00:57:03,349 --> 00:57:01,599
that those help refine us so what's the

1762
00:57:07,349 --> 00:57:03,359
technology for

1763
00:57:10,950 --> 00:57:07,359
i'm torn it's tricky isn't it because

1764
00:57:13,430 --> 00:57:10,960
the idea that we need technology

1765
00:57:14,710 --> 00:57:13,440
and the technology is going to advance

1766
00:57:17,990 --> 00:57:14,720
us and that

1767
00:57:20,150 --> 00:57:18,000
there's this group your network or

1768
00:57:22,069 --> 00:57:20,160
gary schwartz's network that are

1769
00:57:25,109 --> 00:57:22,079
actively trying to get that new

1770
00:57:27,190 --> 00:57:25,119
app out it just doesn't ring true

1771
00:57:28,950 --> 00:57:27,200
to me and one of the ways it doesn't

1772
00:57:29,349 --> 00:57:28,960
ring true is because the whole thing

1773
00:57:32,630 --> 00:57:29,359
with

1774
00:57:34,630 --> 00:57:32,640
time i'm just not sure

1775
00:57:36,150 --> 00:57:34,640
you know let me ask you this question

1776
00:57:39,190 --> 00:57:36,160
straight up

1777
00:57:41,430 --> 00:57:39,200
do you think we are in a special time

1778
00:57:44,549 --> 00:57:41,440
right now

1779
00:57:47,510 --> 00:57:44,559
that's been put about by a lot of folks

1780
00:57:48,950 --> 00:57:47,520
i don't know i mean i think it's special

1781
00:57:53,030 --> 00:57:48,960
in that within the last

1782
00:57:56,470 --> 00:57:53,040
10 to 15 years people are more open to

1783
00:57:58,230 --> 00:57:56,480
this phenomena and there's much more

1784
00:57:59,510 --> 00:57:58,240
access to information about near-death

1785
00:58:03,430 --> 00:57:59,520
experiences

1786
00:58:05,670 --> 00:58:03,440
mediumship adcs deathbed communications

1787
00:58:08,470 --> 00:58:05,680
all these kinds of things

1788
00:58:10,150 --> 00:58:08,480
than ever before so in that way i'd say

1789
00:58:12,470 --> 00:58:10,160
yeah it's a different time it's it's a

1790
00:58:13,430 --> 00:58:12,480
it's a time of change and progress

1791
00:58:15,829 --> 00:58:13,440
towards hopefully

1792
00:58:17,190 --> 00:58:15,839
countering materialism and opening

1793
00:58:19,510 --> 00:58:17,200
people's minds

1794
00:58:21,510 --> 00:58:19,520
and i don't think that's going to happen

1795
00:58:22,150 --> 00:58:21,520
through academia you've been skeptical

1796
00:58:25,829 --> 00:58:22,160
about

1797
00:58:28,630 --> 00:58:25,839
a change within that whole realm

1798
00:58:30,309 --> 00:58:28,640
and dismantling materialism but i think

1799
00:58:31,670 --> 00:58:30,319
it can happen at the grassroots level

1800
00:58:32,470 --> 00:58:31,680
and that's where all these things play

1801
00:58:34,470 --> 00:58:32,480
in

1802
00:58:36,950 --> 00:58:34,480
if there's enough people who have an

1803
00:58:38,549 --> 00:58:36,960
experience or

1804
00:58:40,150 --> 00:58:38,559
are open to this or have read the

1805
00:58:41,829 --> 00:58:40,160
material

1806
00:58:43,190 --> 00:58:41,839
they don't maybe want their tax dollars

1807
00:58:45,750 --> 00:58:43,200
going to fund

1808
00:58:47,190 --> 00:58:45,760
the ongoing secular materialism and that

1809
00:58:48,710 --> 00:58:47,200
whole philosophy

1810
00:58:50,230 --> 00:58:48,720
that's happened at this point so from

1811
00:58:52,870 --> 00:58:50,240
that standpoint i think

1812
00:58:54,390 --> 00:58:52,880
it is a special time in a way i don't

1813
00:58:56,870 --> 00:58:54,400
think it's like

1814
00:58:58,710 --> 00:58:56,880
some people portray you know massive

1815
00:59:00,390 --> 00:58:58,720
shift in vibration and

1816
00:59:02,069 --> 00:59:00,400
people floating off or anything like

1817
00:59:03,910 --> 00:59:02,079
crazy like that

1818
00:59:05,109 --> 00:59:03,920
well it and i don't even know that

1819
00:59:07,109 --> 00:59:05,119
that's crazy

1820
00:59:08,470 --> 00:59:07,119
i think that's all on the table you know

1821
00:59:09,910 --> 00:59:08,480
one of the more interesting interviews i

1822
00:59:10,950 --> 00:59:09,920
did in the last couple years was with a

1823
00:59:13,430 --> 00:59:10,960
guy named

1824
00:59:14,549 --> 00:59:13,440
uh bruce fenton and his wife danny

1825
00:59:16,069 --> 00:59:14,559
fenton and they've done this

1826
00:59:18,069 --> 00:59:16,079
kind of amazing research and she's

1827
00:59:21,349 --> 00:59:18,079
incredibly psychic herself

1828
00:59:24,069 --> 00:59:21,359
but he's very much of an archaeology

1829
00:59:26,549 --> 00:59:24,079
get the evidence kind of guy researcher

1830
00:59:29,030 --> 00:59:26,559
780 000 year history

1831
00:59:29,670 --> 00:59:29,040
tektites in australia that match up with

1832
00:59:32,789 --> 00:59:29,680
the native

1833
00:59:36,549 --> 00:59:32,799
aboriginal people saying visitation

1834
00:59:37,670 --> 00:59:36,559
from aliens which anyone who isn't down

1835
00:59:39,670 --> 00:59:37,680
with that just you know

1836
00:59:42,390 --> 00:59:39,680
pick up the new york times please you

1837
00:59:44,150 --> 00:59:42,400
know pick up the washington post

1838
00:59:45,910 --> 00:59:44,160
i don't know what the real story is but

1839
00:59:47,589 --> 00:59:45,920
where they're leading us right now is

1840
00:59:48,390 --> 00:59:47,599
acknowledging the reality of all that

1841
00:59:51,829 --> 00:59:48,400
stuff

1842
00:59:53,990 --> 00:59:51,839
and it has to has to factor into

1843
00:59:55,750 --> 00:59:54,000
all this discussion we're having because

1844
00:59:59,109 --> 00:59:55,760
et is telepathic

1845
01:00:00,230 --> 00:59:59,119
e.t seems very connected in to this

1846
01:00:01,990 --> 01:00:00,240
extended realm

1847
01:00:03,829 --> 01:00:02,000
i wouldn't even say connected but they

1848
01:00:04,549 --> 01:00:03,839
have a different way apparently of

1849
01:00:06,630 --> 01:00:04,559
interfacing

1850
01:00:07,829 --> 01:00:06,640
this extended realm that's what all the

1851
01:00:10,630 --> 01:00:07,839
accounts say

1852
01:00:11,750 --> 01:00:10,640
but back to the time thing it just

1853
01:00:13,670 --> 01:00:11,760
shatters it take

1854
01:00:16,069 --> 01:00:13,680
uh michael cremo if you're familiar with

1855
01:00:18,630 --> 01:00:16,079
him though forbidden archaeology stuff

1856
01:00:20,069 --> 01:00:18,640
which is phenomenal phenomenal hard

1857
01:00:24,549 --> 01:00:20,079
science you know and

1858
01:00:26,309 --> 01:00:24,559
the minor 49ers guys are digging they're

1859
01:00:28,069 --> 01:00:26,319
digging digging digging away in the gold

1860
01:00:31,589 --> 01:00:28,079
mine and they find a hammer

1861
01:00:32,870 --> 01:00:31,599
buried in rock that's millions of years

1862
01:00:36,390 --> 01:00:32,880
old and it's a freaking

1863
01:00:39,270 --> 01:00:36,400
hammer and how did it so there is

1864
01:00:40,870 --> 01:00:39,280
a lot of evidence pointing to the idea

1865
01:00:43,589 --> 01:00:40,880
that the timeline

1866
01:00:45,670 --> 01:00:43,599
that we're operating under and part of

1867
01:00:47,750 --> 01:00:45,680
it is because our religious traditions

1868
01:00:48,870 --> 01:00:47,760
kind of box us into a very narrow

1869
01:00:52,789 --> 01:00:48,880
timeline

1870
01:00:54,069 --> 01:00:52,799
is completely unsustainable in terms of

1871
01:00:55,910 --> 01:00:54,079
the evidence we have

1872
01:00:58,069 --> 01:00:55,920
and that would push me in a completely

1873
01:01:01,270 --> 01:00:58,079
different direction regarding time

1874
01:01:02,950 --> 01:01:01,280
but i'm also with you in terms of

1875
01:01:06,230 --> 01:01:02,960
everything that you said

1876
01:01:08,870 --> 01:01:06,240
and then in terms of there does

1877
01:01:10,230 --> 01:01:08,880
seem to be an increased number of people

1878
01:01:11,190 --> 01:01:10,240
that are having these kinds of

1879
01:01:13,510 --> 01:01:11,200
experiences

1880
01:01:15,589 --> 01:01:13,520
and we can even point to technology that

1881
01:01:16,950 --> 01:01:15,599
would point to that you know there's not

1882
01:01:18,870 --> 01:01:16,960
only resuscitation

1883
01:01:20,470 --> 01:01:18,880
but for god shakes how can we get past

1884
01:01:22,390 --> 01:01:20,480
the genetic

1885
01:01:23,670 --> 01:01:22,400
revolution and the fact that we are on

1886
01:01:26,630 --> 01:01:23,680
the verge of being

1887
01:01:28,069 --> 01:01:26,640
the last humans i mean that is just

1888
01:01:30,470 --> 01:01:28,079
we're gene splicing

1889
01:01:31,670 --> 01:01:30,480
and you can't stop that that just is

1890
01:01:37,270 --> 01:01:31,680
going to happen

1891
01:01:38,230 --> 01:01:37,280
ludite who wants to bury your head in

1892
01:01:39,990 --> 01:01:38,240
the sand

1893
01:01:41,430 --> 01:01:40,000
but the rest of the world is going to

1894
01:01:45,109 --> 01:01:41,440
move on so

1895
01:01:48,309 --> 01:01:45,119
i'm torn on it i just i wish it was more

1896
01:01:49,270 --> 01:01:48,319
a real part of the conversation because

1897
01:01:53,270 --> 01:01:49,280
i think it gets

1898
01:01:55,670 --> 01:01:53,280
into very challenging bit of

1899
01:01:56,470 --> 01:01:55,680
subtlety about all this stuff that we're

1900
01:01:59,510 --> 01:01:56,480
talking about

1901
01:02:02,710 --> 01:01:59,520
do you have any thoughts on any of that

1902
01:02:04,069 --> 01:02:02,720
well the only thought i had

1903
01:02:06,309 --> 01:02:04,079
i was kind of drifting off just this

1904
01:02:07,589 --> 01:02:06,319
whole idea of some of these materialists

1905
01:02:09,589 --> 01:02:07,599
thinking like oh

1906
01:02:10,789 --> 01:02:09,599
i want to embed my consciousness in some

1907
01:02:13,829 --> 01:02:10,799
sort of

1908
01:02:16,309 --> 01:02:13,839
ai robot thing so i can live forever

1909
01:02:17,589 --> 01:02:16,319
because their view of what life is is

1910
01:02:18,950 --> 01:02:17,599
strictly materialist

1911
01:02:20,710 --> 01:02:18,960
i don't know how you do something like

1912
01:02:23,829 --> 01:02:20,720
that but

1913
01:02:24,710 --> 01:02:23,839
i don't know where ai is going or what's

1914
01:02:27,670 --> 01:02:24,720
going to happen

1915
01:02:30,150 --> 01:02:27,680
hopefully it could be useful to society

1916
01:02:32,710 --> 01:02:30,160
and to humanity and help us

1917
01:02:34,069 --> 01:02:32,720
repair some of the damage we've done but

1918
01:02:35,589 --> 01:02:34,079
i don't know i mean there

1919
01:02:37,670 --> 01:02:35,599
there are people with alternative

1920
01:02:39,270 --> 01:02:37,680
motives ulterior motives

1921
01:02:42,470 --> 01:02:39,280
potentially too that could steer it in

1922
01:02:45,910 --> 01:02:42,480
the wrong direction as long as we have

1923
01:02:47,430 --> 01:02:45,920
divisiveness and people who are

1924
01:02:49,670 --> 01:02:47,440
you know wanting to use it for other

1925
01:02:51,910 --> 01:02:49,680
reasons or against other cultures or

1926
01:02:53,510 --> 01:02:51,920
nations or whatever it could go the

1927
01:02:57,270 --> 01:02:53,520
wrong way so i

1928
01:03:00,630 --> 01:02:57,280
i just don't know well but

1929
01:03:02,870 --> 01:03:00,640
i is that far enough given what we know

1930
01:03:04,230 --> 01:03:02,880
you know you know that the show you know

1931
01:03:07,910 --> 01:03:04,240
we've covered the

1932
01:03:11,750 --> 01:03:07,920
mk ultra stuff extensively we are

1933
01:03:15,670 --> 01:03:11,760
mk ultra we are living that our society

1934
01:03:18,230 --> 01:03:15,680
united states of america we are

1935
01:03:19,910 --> 01:03:18,240
putting whitley strieber at nine years

1936
01:03:22,630 --> 01:03:19,920
old in a faraday cage

1937
01:03:24,150 --> 01:03:22,640
in order to create disassociative

1938
01:03:28,390 --> 01:03:24,160
identity disorder

1939
01:03:31,029 --> 01:03:28,400
because it creates an opening for

1940
01:03:32,549 --> 01:03:31,039
beings that occupy this extended

1941
01:03:35,109 --> 01:03:32,559
consciousness realm

1942
01:03:37,349 --> 01:03:35,119
and we don't understand the topography

1943
01:03:39,190 --> 01:03:37,359
of that extended consciousness realm

1944
01:03:40,870 --> 01:03:39,200
we can talk about the goodness and the

1945
01:03:43,430 --> 01:03:40,880
healing and all that stuff

1946
01:03:44,309 --> 01:03:43,440
but we don't understand the other forces

1947
01:03:49,990 --> 01:03:44,319
that

1948
01:03:50,470 --> 01:03:50,000
frequently on the show my interview with

1949
01:03:53,990 --> 01:03:50,480
dr

1950
01:03:56,470 --> 01:03:54,000
tom zinzer who was a psychologist

1951
01:03:57,510 --> 01:03:56,480
in who was a psychologist and

1952
01:03:59,109 --> 01:03:57,520
hypnotherapist

1953
01:04:00,870 --> 01:03:59,119
in grand rapids michigan before he

1954
01:04:03,910 --> 01:04:00,880
retired but

1955
01:04:05,589 --> 01:04:03,920
part of his whole experience

1956
01:04:07,750 --> 01:04:05,599
in counseling with people and he's a

1957
01:04:10,309 --> 01:04:07,760
people helper right he's trying to

1958
01:04:12,630 --> 01:04:10,319
help people overcome traumatic

1959
01:04:16,390 --> 01:04:12,640
experiences that have caused them to

1960
01:04:18,390 --> 01:04:16,400
have this kind of ego state separation

1961
01:04:20,150 --> 01:04:18,400
which we all have to some extent and we

1962
01:04:21,589 --> 01:04:20,160
can all relate to those different parts

1963
01:04:22,950 --> 01:04:21,599
of ourselves and he's trying to help

1964
01:04:24,710 --> 01:04:22,960
people integrate that i don't want to

1965
01:04:28,069 --> 01:04:24,720
digress too far

1966
01:04:28,870 --> 01:04:28,079
but sometimes the interference that's

1967
01:04:32,150 --> 01:04:28,880
coming

1968
01:04:35,270 --> 01:04:32,160
spirit

1969
01:04:37,589 --> 01:04:35,280
right that's what he reports so i

1970
01:04:38,390 --> 01:04:37,599
i think that again when we talk about

1971
01:04:40,630 --> 01:04:38,400
mediums

1972
01:04:43,190 --> 01:04:40,640
and we talk about all this stuff it's

1973
01:04:46,510 --> 01:04:43,200
like we have to broaden the conversation

1974
01:04:47,750 --> 01:04:46,520
and understand just the range of

1975
01:04:50,549 --> 01:04:47,760
possibilities

1976
01:04:51,910 --> 01:04:50,559
that exist out there so the the person

1977
01:04:54,710 --> 01:04:51,920
comes in and they're

1978
01:04:55,750 --> 01:04:54,720
anxious and they're having this anxiety

1979
01:04:58,870 --> 01:04:55,760
and this other stuff

1980
01:05:00,630 --> 01:04:58,880
and through his through his work and

1981
01:05:03,510 --> 01:05:00,640
through deep hypnosis

1982
01:05:04,390 --> 01:05:03,520
tom is able to discover that it is a

1983
01:05:07,029 --> 01:05:04,400
deceased

1984
01:05:08,870 --> 01:05:07,039
mother who's there who's causing that

1985
01:05:11,349 --> 01:05:08,880
and then he's able to bring

1986
01:05:12,549 --> 01:05:11,359
you can probably relate to this or we

1987
01:05:13,910 --> 01:05:12,559
don't know if it's true but we can

1988
01:05:16,230 --> 01:05:13,920
relate to the story

1989
01:05:18,390 --> 01:05:16,240
brings in the spirit guide brings in the

1990
01:05:20,950 --> 01:05:18,400
light helps reach the mother

1991
01:05:22,549 --> 01:05:20,960
helps show her that she needs to move on

1992
01:05:23,109 --> 01:05:22,559
and that this is really what needs to

1993
01:05:25,910 --> 01:05:23,119
happen

1994
01:05:27,589 --> 01:05:25,920
but this whole i don't want to call it a

1995
01:05:29,910 --> 01:05:27,599
story this whole bit of

1996
01:05:32,230 --> 01:05:29,920
evidence this whole bit of data puts a

1997
01:05:35,510 --> 01:05:32,240
completely different spin on it

1998
01:05:38,950 --> 01:05:35,520
as does the darkest part

1999
01:05:41,029 --> 01:05:38,960
of the mk ultra program we're like sure

2000
01:05:42,630 --> 01:05:41,039
bring in that demonic entity as long as

2001
01:05:43,910 --> 01:05:42,640
they'll do some work for us for the

2002
01:05:45,910 --> 01:05:43,920
united states government

2003
01:05:48,069 --> 01:05:45,920
as long as they'll do give us some stuff

2004
01:05:48,549 --> 01:05:48,079
yeah you can come in here you can invade

2005
01:05:50,870 --> 01:05:48,559
the

2006
01:05:52,069 --> 01:05:50,880
mental space and traumatize this child

2007
01:05:55,750 --> 01:05:52,079
no problem with me

2008
01:05:57,829 --> 01:05:55,760
let's see what we can get out of it yeah

2009
01:05:59,829 --> 01:05:57,839
i i agree with you that there's a higher

2010
01:06:02,950 --> 01:05:59,839
hierarchy of consciousness

2011
01:06:04,309 --> 01:06:02,960
and um if people dabble in this

2012
01:06:07,029 --> 01:06:04,319
and don't think about that it's a

2013
01:06:10,230 --> 01:06:07,039
mistake i mean the mediums that i know

2014
01:06:11,990 --> 01:06:10,240
all have a practice um

2015
01:06:13,990 --> 01:06:12,000
they're trying to get to a higher level

2016
01:06:17,349 --> 01:06:14,000
where they're guarding themselves

2017
01:06:20,150 --> 01:06:17,359
i mean i can't prove that this is how it

2018
01:06:21,589 --> 01:06:20,160
works but it seems to work because

2019
01:06:23,190 --> 01:06:21,599
the information they bring through is

2020
01:06:25,430 --> 01:06:23,200
healing and helpful it's not

2021
01:06:26,470 --> 01:06:25,440
for those kinds of purposes but yeah

2022
01:06:28,950 --> 01:06:26,480
there are other

2023
01:06:30,789 --> 01:06:28,960
i think other variations of the realms

2024
01:06:33,190 --> 01:06:30,799
that may be lower

2025
01:06:34,230 --> 01:06:33,200
in vibration consciousness whatever you

2026
01:06:36,309 --> 01:06:34,240
want to call it

2027
01:06:37,910 --> 01:06:36,319
that people might tap into and like you

2028
01:06:40,870 --> 01:06:37,920
said if they don't care

2029
01:06:41,589 --> 01:06:40,880
they open themselves up to potential

2030
01:06:43,990 --> 01:06:41,599
problems

2031
01:06:46,309 --> 01:06:44,000
associated with that what about the

2032
01:06:47,910 --> 01:06:46,319
scary part that the more we look the

2033
01:06:51,270 --> 01:06:47,920
deeper we look

2034
01:06:52,390 --> 01:06:51,280
into the jeffrey epsteins and gaslyne

2035
01:06:56,069 --> 01:06:52,400
maxwell

2036
01:06:57,430 --> 01:06:56,079
is that that is us that is the united

2037
01:07:00,230 --> 01:06:57,440
states of america

2038
01:07:01,349 --> 01:07:00,240
empire that is who we are that is how we

2039
01:07:03,910 --> 01:07:01,359
got on top

2040
01:07:04,950 --> 01:07:03,920
and that is how we will stay on top for

2041
01:07:07,029 --> 01:07:04,960
the next

2042
01:07:08,390 --> 01:07:07,039
however long we stay on top that's

2043
01:07:11,589 --> 01:07:08,400
unsettling

2044
01:07:14,950 --> 01:07:11,599
yeah how do we change that i mean

2045
01:07:15,270 --> 01:07:14,960
it's it's sad are we supposed to change

2046
01:07:18,069 --> 01:07:15,280
that

2047
01:07:19,270 --> 01:07:18,079
which gets back to this doing thing gets

2048
01:07:22,630 --> 01:07:19,280
back to my thing

2049
01:07:25,670 --> 01:07:22,640
world what world are we really about

2050
01:07:27,029 --> 01:07:25,680
trying to change this world or and and

2051
01:07:30,390 --> 01:07:27,039
again i relate it back to

2052
01:07:33,750 --> 01:07:30,400
i relate to your model let me try and

2053
01:07:36,950 --> 01:07:33,760
increase my ability to be compassionate

2054
01:07:39,750 --> 01:07:36,960
to the ones around me to the ones let me

2055
01:07:41,589 --> 01:07:39,760
see the whole thing let me look at the

2056
01:07:43,270 --> 01:07:41,599
abyss and understand that it's there

2057
01:07:45,589 --> 01:07:43,280
so that i can step over it not that i

2058
01:07:46,470 --> 01:07:45,599
can stare into it but let me not get

2059
01:07:49,430 --> 01:07:46,480
fooled into

2060
01:07:50,789 --> 01:07:49,440
that's my job is to develop a freaking

2061
01:07:54,069 --> 01:07:50,799
soul phone

2062
01:07:57,190 --> 01:07:54,079
no just you know i was talking to

2063
01:08:00,309 --> 01:07:57,200
dr evan alexander and terrific guy

2064
01:08:01,349 --> 01:08:00,319
i love what he's done and what he's been

2065
01:08:04,470 --> 01:08:01,359
through and

2066
01:08:06,710 --> 01:08:04,480
you know of course he's the guy wrote

2067
01:08:08,549 --> 01:08:06,720
the new york times bestselling book

2068
01:08:09,750 --> 01:08:08,559
oh what's the name of it he wrote for

2069
01:08:12,069 --> 01:08:09,760
heaven right

2070
01:08:14,069 --> 01:08:12,079
you're right you're right so it was you

2071
01:08:15,750 --> 01:08:14,079
know harvard neurosurgeon all this who

2072
01:08:18,709 --> 01:08:15,760
was put through the ringer

2073
01:08:19,349 --> 01:08:18,719
by whatever those cultural forces are

2074
01:08:22,870 --> 01:08:19,359
out there

2075
01:08:24,709 --> 01:08:22,880
that want to deny that you are more

2076
01:08:26,309 --> 01:08:24,719
that you have a connection that you're a

2077
01:08:27,990 --> 01:08:26,319
spiritual being whatever

2078
01:08:30,149 --> 01:08:28,000
that energy is and i think that energy

2079
01:08:32,070 --> 01:08:30,159
is very dark and very subtly dark

2080
01:08:34,309 --> 01:08:32,080
a lot of people don't see through it but

2081
01:08:36,229 --> 01:08:34,319
anyways i'm talking to

2082
01:08:37,590 --> 01:08:36,239
evan alexander and you don't get to be a

2083
01:08:39,990 --> 01:08:37,600
harvard neurosurgeon

2084
01:08:41,829 --> 01:08:40,000
without being a doer without being a get

2085
01:08:43,590 --> 01:08:41,839
the job done kind of thing

2086
01:08:45,829 --> 01:08:43,600
and i bounce this off and like you know

2087
01:08:48,470 --> 01:08:45,839
i struggle with it as kind of a non-dual

2088
01:08:50,070 --> 01:08:48,480
kind of yoga kind of person world what

2089
01:08:52,149 --> 01:08:50,080
world why are we trying to do

2090
01:08:53,510 --> 01:08:52,159
constantly because i'm a doer too you

2091
01:08:54,870 --> 01:08:53,520
know what you are too we're both

2092
01:08:57,430 --> 01:08:54,880
business guys

2093
01:08:58,870 --> 01:08:57,440
and he goes you know what i gotta back

2094
01:09:02,550 --> 01:08:58,880
up i gotta agree with you

2095
01:09:05,669 --> 01:09:02,560
my partner karen that's what she says

2096
01:09:07,349 --> 01:09:05,679
be the love you are

2097
01:09:08,709 --> 01:09:07,359
and i thought that was such an awesome

2098
01:09:11,749 --> 01:09:08,719
quote it's not

2099
01:09:13,430 --> 01:09:11,759
be love which is more doing it's just

2100
01:09:15,110 --> 01:09:13,440
that's what you are you're a spirit

2101
01:09:18,550 --> 01:09:15,120
being you're pure love

2102
01:09:21,349 --> 01:09:18,560
just allow that to be you don't

2103
01:09:21,829 --> 01:09:21,359
have to make a freaking soul phone it's

2104
01:09:25,430 --> 01:09:21,839
not

2105
01:09:28,709 --> 01:09:25,440
your the world isn't waiting

2106
01:09:30,309 --> 01:09:28,719
for you to do that i i don't know that

2107
01:09:32,229 --> 01:09:30,319
i could see both sides of it i just

2108
01:09:36,149 --> 01:09:32,239
throw that out there as potentially an

2109
01:09:39,430 --> 01:09:36,159
interesting topic to kind of hash out

2110
01:09:41,189 --> 01:09:39,440
yeah i think if all of us do our

2111
01:09:41,749 --> 01:09:41,199
individual parts and we all take that

2112
01:09:43,590 --> 01:09:41,759
path

2113
01:09:45,030 --> 01:09:43,600
then you can bring then change could

2114
01:09:46,950 --> 01:09:45,040
happen whether we think it's supposed to

2115
01:09:48,070 --> 01:09:46,960
happen or not but if we each are loving

2116
01:09:50,149 --> 01:09:48,080
and caring

2117
01:09:52,070 --> 01:09:50,159
and we're being that love like you said

2118
01:09:53,910 --> 01:09:52,080
i think that can have an exponential

2119
01:09:55,510 --> 01:09:53,920
effect it kind of goes back to the

2120
01:09:57,110 --> 01:09:55,520
grassroots kind of thing i've talked

2121
01:09:59,110 --> 01:09:57,120
about earlier

2122
01:10:00,229 --> 01:09:59,120
and maybe if we have this infrastructure

2123
01:10:02,790 --> 01:10:00,239
of our government

2124
01:10:04,149 --> 01:10:02,800
within the world that we're not going to

2125
01:10:06,310 --> 01:10:04,159
be able to change or whatever

2126
01:10:07,430 --> 01:10:06,320
then maybe that's the best approach

2127
01:10:10,709 --> 01:10:07,440
individually

2128
01:10:11,910 --> 01:10:10,719
collectively we treat people the right

2129
01:10:14,870 --> 01:10:11,920
way we show love

2130
01:10:16,070 --> 01:10:14,880
uh caring empathy compassion and that's

2131
01:10:17,910 --> 01:10:16,080
who we are

2132
01:10:21,030 --> 01:10:17,920
that's the best we can do maybe and

2133
01:10:23,350 --> 01:10:21,040
that's maybe that's good enough

2134
01:10:24,070 --> 01:10:23,360
yeah i i almost think it has to be good

2135
01:10:26,550 --> 01:10:24,080
enough

2136
01:10:27,910 --> 01:10:26,560
and i also always come back to the et

2137
01:10:29,189 --> 01:10:27,920
thing because

2138
01:10:31,750 --> 01:10:29,199
people who want to leave that out of the

2139
01:10:32,390 --> 01:10:31,760
equation it's like can't leave that out

2140
01:10:34,149 --> 01:10:32,400
of the equation

2141
01:10:35,590 --> 01:10:34,159
i don't know what to make of it i don't

2142
01:10:37,590 --> 01:10:35,600
have any special knowledge

2143
01:10:39,350 --> 01:10:37,600
i don't have any special connection

2144
01:10:41,510 --> 01:10:39,360
visitation information

2145
01:10:43,350 --> 01:10:41,520
any of that stuff i just look at the

2146
01:10:44,149 --> 01:10:43,360
data and the data is right there in your

2147
01:10:45,910 --> 01:10:44,159
face

2148
01:10:47,510 --> 01:10:45,920
but the one point that intrigues me

2149
01:10:50,630 --> 01:10:47,520
about that is

2150
01:10:53,750 --> 01:10:50,640
apparently where they're at in the

2151
01:10:54,470 --> 01:10:53,760
technology leap they could do whatever

2152
01:10:56,790 --> 01:10:54,480
they want

2153
01:10:57,750 --> 01:10:56,800
right i mean they disabled those nuclear

2154
01:11:01,270 --> 01:10:57,760
weapons

2155
01:11:04,070 --> 01:11:01,280
in wyoming or montana wherever they were

2156
01:11:05,510 --> 01:11:04,080
they can just as easily use them to to

2157
01:11:08,709 --> 01:11:05,520
do it and maybe some of them

2158
01:11:11,669 --> 01:11:08,719
are doing some very nefarious things

2159
01:11:12,070 --> 01:11:11,679
but i guess where i'm scaling that is on

2160
01:11:15,110 --> 01:11:12,080
the

2161
01:11:16,870 --> 01:11:15,120
hierarchy scale at any time god could

2162
01:11:17,270 --> 01:11:16,880
change everything right i mean that's

2163
01:11:19,590 --> 01:11:17,280
kind of

2164
01:11:21,110 --> 01:11:19,600
implied in this whole thing so again it

2165
01:11:23,030 --> 01:11:21,120
gets back to be

2166
01:11:24,630 --> 01:11:23,040
i think i just want to take my foot off

2167
01:11:28,070 --> 01:11:24,640
the gas of the

2168
01:11:31,189 --> 01:11:28,080
i need to be the change agent

2169
01:11:32,870 --> 01:11:31,199
i do need to do everything that feels

2170
01:11:35,669 --> 01:11:32,880
like the right thing

2171
01:11:37,990 --> 01:11:35,679
for me at the moment but i wonder if i

2172
01:11:41,110 --> 01:11:38,000
really need to think that

2173
01:11:43,990 --> 01:11:41,120
i'm the doer you know rather than just

2174
01:11:45,510 --> 01:11:44,000
being it's an interesting dichotomy in

2175
01:11:47,990 --> 01:11:45,520
this world because

2176
01:11:49,590 --> 01:11:48,000
i think you have to have enough ego for

2177
01:11:51,350 --> 01:11:49,600
certain things to happen

2178
01:11:53,750 --> 01:11:51,360
but at the same time that's not really

2179
01:11:55,590 --> 01:11:53,760
who we are it's part of manifesting

2180
01:11:59,669 --> 01:11:55,600
something in the world that maybe

2181
01:12:01,669 --> 01:11:59,679
has to has to unfold so

2182
01:12:03,990 --> 01:12:01,679
maybe it's a balance between those i'm

2183
01:12:07,189 --> 01:12:04,000
not sure

2184
01:12:10,149 --> 01:12:07,199
you keep

2185
01:12:12,229 --> 01:12:10,159
going forward so where where do you see

2186
01:12:12,630 --> 01:12:12,239
yourself going forward from here what's

2187
01:12:16,310 --> 01:12:12,640
gonna

2188
01:12:18,310 --> 01:12:16,320
you're doing

2189
01:12:20,310 --> 01:12:18,320
well once i quit the corporate world

2190
01:12:22,870 --> 01:12:20,320
hopefully before too long i mean i'm

2191
01:12:24,390 --> 01:12:22,880
getting there i would like to invest

2192
01:12:25,990 --> 01:12:24,400
more time with the helping parents the

2193
01:12:29,270 --> 01:12:26,000
organization

2194
01:12:31,189 --> 01:12:29,280
to do even more for people and to expand

2195
01:12:32,870 --> 01:12:31,199
for people whose needs aren't being met

2196
01:12:35,350 --> 01:12:32,880
that have that need

2197
01:12:36,950 --> 01:12:35,360
and i'm writing another book now that's

2198
01:12:39,510 --> 01:12:36,960
more about what it was like growing up

2199
01:12:41,189 --> 01:12:39,520
with the father that i had

2200
01:12:42,630 --> 01:12:41,199
and then sharing some of those insights

2201
01:12:45,430 --> 01:12:42,640
and stories

2202
01:12:47,510 --> 01:12:45,440
i would like to you know continue that

2203
01:12:49,990 --> 01:12:47,520
certification process for the mediums

2204
01:12:51,350 --> 01:12:50,000
maybe get back to you and see if we can

2205
01:12:52,470 --> 01:12:51,360
do an experiment with that that would be

2206
01:12:54,149 --> 01:12:52,480
kind of cool

2207
01:12:55,510 --> 01:12:54,159
we can even see if we can pull in

2208
01:12:57,430 --> 01:12:55,520
skeptical

2209
01:12:59,669 --> 01:12:57,440
listeners but if we can share some of

2210
01:13:00,870 --> 01:12:59,679
that i think you can figure out how to

2211
01:13:04,390 --> 01:13:00,880
format that

2212
01:13:06,149 --> 01:13:04,400
yeah um and then you know on a personal

2213
01:13:07,669 --> 01:13:06,159
level i like to travel i look forward to

2214
01:13:10,310 --> 01:13:07,679
traveling overseas again

2215
01:13:11,750 --> 01:13:10,320
and i'm a grandfather father now and

2216
01:13:13,430 --> 01:13:11,760
spend more time with my

2217
01:13:14,790 --> 01:13:13,440
baby granddaughter and the other one

2218
01:13:17,430 --> 01:13:14,800
that's on the way

2219
01:13:18,790 --> 01:13:17,440
so those are some of the aspirations i

2220
01:13:20,390 --> 01:13:18,800
have for the future

2221
01:13:21,910 --> 01:13:20,400
and as you know i like to do a lot of

2222
01:13:24,229 --> 01:13:21,920
different things i play guitar

2223
01:13:25,830 --> 01:13:24,239
i like to write songs i like to write

2224
01:13:28,790 --> 01:13:25,840
books

2225
01:13:30,830 --> 01:13:28,800
i'm slow at doing it but when you when

2226
01:13:32,390 --> 01:13:30,840
you're dabbling in a lot of areas it's

2227
01:13:35,350 --> 01:13:32,400
uh

2228
01:13:36,470 --> 01:13:35,360
can take time but i just enjoy people i

2229
01:13:38,470 --> 01:13:36,480
enjoy

2230
01:13:40,390 --> 01:13:38,480
like your podcast just opening up my

2231
01:13:41,830 --> 01:13:40,400
mind to new perspectives and hearing the

2232
01:13:44,070 --> 01:13:41,840
guests that you have and

2233
01:13:45,510 --> 01:13:44,080
where they're coming from i enjoy that

2234
01:13:47,750 --> 01:13:45,520
and i'm even doing

2235
01:13:49,350 --> 01:13:47,760
with gordon smith right now a mediumship

2236
01:13:50,790 --> 01:13:49,360
development course so i'm going through

2237
01:13:52,310 --> 01:13:50,800
that myself

2238
01:13:53,990 --> 01:13:52,320
just to see what's there because i've

2239
01:13:55,990 --> 01:13:54,000
actually had some of my own experiences

2240
01:13:58,070 --> 01:13:56,000
i mean coming from the lineage i have

2241
01:14:00,310 --> 01:13:58,080
as julie baichel notes you know it's

2242
01:14:01,910 --> 01:14:00,320
often a hereditary thing and i've had

2243
01:14:04,550 --> 01:14:01,920
some pretty crazy stuff

2244
01:14:05,990 --> 01:14:04,560
that you know validated i i do have this

2245
01:14:06,870 --> 01:14:06,000
at some level i've just not really

2246
01:14:09,669 --> 01:14:06,880
sought

2247
01:14:10,950 --> 01:14:09,679
to bring it out or do that and i think

2248
01:14:14,070 --> 01:14:10,960
if i ever did it would

2249
01:14:15,030 --> 01:14:14,080
kind of shift you know um the

2250
01:14:17,350 --> 01:14:15,040
perspective on

2251
01:14:19,430 --> 01:14:17,360
who i am and what i'm doing today

2252
01:14:22,630 --> 01:14:19,440
because then you can no longer be this

2253
01:14:23,270 --> 01:14:22,640
impartial person who's who's writing

2254
01:14:26,470 --> 01:14:23,280
about this

2255
01:14:30,950 --> 01:14:26,480
and everything yeah i wanted to mention

2256
01:14:34,310 --> 01:14:30,960
that we've kind of touched on this but

2257
01:14:37,430 --> 01:14:34,320
you really have throughout your journey

2258
01:14:39,110 --> 01:14:37,440
opened yourself up to a lot of thanks

2259
01:14:40,630 --> 01:14:39,120
i i love the story i was hoping we could

2260
01:14:42,630 --> 01:14:40,640
get to the story on the

2261
01:14:43,910 --> 01:14:42,640
chakra centering story is just an

2262
01:14:46,390 --> 01:14:43,920
amazing story but

2263
01:14:48,070 --> 01:14:46,400
we'll leave that for people to pick up

2264
01:14:50,550 --> 01:14:48,080
messages from the afterlife

2265
01:14:52,070 --> 01:14:50,560
a book that describes that and a lot of

2266
01:14:54,149 --> 01:14:52,080
other encounters and

2267
01:14:55,350 --> 01:14:54,159
you are definitely someone who's living

2268
01:14:57,830 --> 01:14:55,360
through

2269
01:14:58,709 --> 01:14:57,840
that spiritual growth in a very real way

2270
01:15:01,430 --> 01:14:58,719
and people

2271
01:15:02,229 --> 01:15:01,440
also should check out your psychic

2272
01:15:04,229 --> 01:15:02,239
potential

2273
01:15:05,510 --> 01:15:04,239
very very interesting we look forward to

2274
01:15:07,669 --> 01:15:05,520
hearing more about

2275
01:15:10,229 --> 01:15:07,679
your relationship with your dad and what

2276
01:15:13,510 --> 01:15:10,239
that was like growing up and then

2277
01:15:15,910 --> 01:15:13,520
you know i think the the twist there is

2278
01:15:17,910 --> 01:15:15,920
you don't go in that direction you know

2279
01:15:18,950 --> 01:15:17,920
and then you're pulled in that direction

2280
01:15:21,030 --> 01:15:18,960
and

2281
01:15:22,149 --> 01:15:21,040
that whole thing has got to unfold

2282
01:15:24,550 --> 01:15:22,159
itself so

2283
01:15:25,669 --> 01:15:24,560
a lot to stay in touch with and keep

2284
01:15:27,669 --> 01:15:25,679
track of so

2285
01:15:28,870 --> 01:15:27,679
it's been absolutely terrific having you

2286
01:15:32,310 --> 01:15:28,880
on mark thanks again

2287
01:15:33,990 --> 01:15:32,320
for joining me i had fun thanks again to

2288
01:15:34,709 --> 01:15:34,000
mark arlen for joining me today on

2289
01:15:36,790 --> 01:15:34,719
skeptico

2290
01:15:38,229 --> 01:15:36,800
the one question i'd have to tee up from

2291
01:15:40,709 --> 01:15:38,239
this interview is

2292
01:15:41,270 --> 01:15:40,719
do you think technology has a role to

2293
01:15:44,390 --> 01:15:41,280
play

2294
01:15:45,590 --> 01:15:44,400
in after death communication let me know

2295
01:15:46,550 --> 01:15:45,600
your thoughts track me down in the

2296
01:15:49,510 --> 01:15:46,560
skeptical forum

2297
01:15:49,910 --> 01:15:49,520
email me find me however you're guided

2298
01:15:54,149 --> 01:15:49,920
to